Another thing is that the world we live in is increasingly hostile to the kind of mysticism that religion needs to peddle to survive; we're figuring out more things every day, providing solutions to universal problems that actually work, and the more we discover, the less apt it is to believe in magical solutions, which is all religion really has. The church can only ever provide non-answers, justifications to its varying positions that rely solely on magic, nothing real, and it's simply a fact that this mystical stuff no longer looms quite as large, because there's less ignorance for it to loom in. Once upon a time theists could point to diseases and call them demons, and they had a real world consequence to attach their mysticism to, but they can't do that with the advent of germ theory. Ditto with lightning, and volcanoes, and varying mental health problems; the church has effectively lost all its toeholds in the real world with which to justify their nonsense.

That's some good news, even if it's old news. The article observes one particular correlation that I've noticed myself.

As society continues to move forward, the church not only doesn't follow, but it openly and actively regresses. Acceptance of LGBT individuals is on the rise -- church aggressively attacks gay marriage. Abortion is becomig more popular -- church bans abortion. Means of contraception are easily accessible -- church says condoms are bad... and so on.

The youth isn't drawn to the church anymore. The Internet makes knowledge and information easily accessible and verifiable. It also provides tons of false information and so we become more skeptical and the need to apply crtical thinking is more present in everyday life. Combine the smarter young generation with the backwardness of the church and we get no interest.

I'm not optimistic enough to believe organized relgion will disappear completely, but there is hope that it will be reduced into a minority.

And good riddance.

(March 24, 2015 at 12:18 pm)Esquilax Wrote: Another thing is that the world we live in is increasingly hostile to the kind of mysticism that religion needs to peddle to survive; we're figuring out more things every day, providing solutions to universal problems that actually work, and the more we discover, the less apt it is to believe in magical solutions, which is all religion really has. The church can only ever provide non-answers, justifications to its varying positions that rely solely on magic, nothing real, and it's simply a fact that this mystical stuff no longer looms quite as large, because there's less ignorance for it to loom in. Once upon a time theists could point to diseases and call them demons, and they had a real world consequence to attach their mysticism to, but they can't do that with the advent of germ theory. Ditto with lightning, and volcanoes, and varying mental health problems; the church has effectively lost all its toeholds in the real world with which to justify their nonsense.

I agree we have are and still are becoming less ignorant as a species. It took a long time but its finally happening and its a good thing we are becoming less ignorant and starting to have less irrational beliefs because we can finally progress more than be stuck and left behind wondering what could have been now we are finally catching up with technology that could have been. Also the less irrational we are as a people the better we would treat one another looking past skin color because were all the same religion doesn't teach anyone that.

No matter the reason it is good news.

(March 24, 2015 at 11:34 am)robvalue Wrote: Big time. After doing no research I firmly conclude the Internet is a massive factor. Being able to check stuff you are told instantly makes it so much harder to insulate children from reality and scientific knoweldge.

I fully concur and second this personal lack of research.
Strange and totally unsupported assertions can only flourish in isolation. When forced to compete with assertions backed up by evidence, reasoned models that coalesce into theory, reproducibility and borne out predictions, religion cannot maintain. The regression to a primitive, coercive approach is more prevalent today because the passive system of isolation and indoctrination is eroded by modern communication and accumulating evidence. Religions don't care about truth, they 'care' about propagating themselves. 'Care' is in scare quotes because, as non-self aware entities, religions don't actually care about anything. But it is those religions that propagate and expand best that are most available for observation and so have the appearance of intention.

(March 24, 2015 at 12:44 pm)Minimalist Wrote: No matter the reason it is good news.

Champagne Cigars for a party.
Then pouring cheap shitty bear onto the grave of religion?

My own in-depth research (in the UK/ England & Wales) actually puts this massive drop in attendance here to way back in the 60s and last generation's revolt against the religious conservatism of their parents.

Then let the cohort effect take hold and you have a situation where children today are even less likely to espouse a religion than their parents.

The globalisation of knowledge has put religious claims under more scrutiny than ever. In the marketplace of ideas, at least in Western and Northern Europe, those ideas are - Edit - I initially said losing, but actually it would be more accurate to say they are found unconvincing when compared to the alternatives.

Very nice. It's not fast enough for our tastes but the writing is really on the wall.

Whether this is an indication of greater critical thinking or differing "coolness" factors is irrelevant in the short run. It's in our favor. It can swing back the other way for a short time but the overall trend is irreversible. People like us are successfully moving the line in the right direction. We are winning the war.

And of the religious, how many could even pass the least stringent test possible of fealty and understanding of their professed faith ??


We certainly see a steady parade of apostates, schismatics, heretics and blasphemers here.


And of each of all the schisms of christerism, how many in the bureaucracy of each could pass a polygraph exam ?????




God may not be dead (yet) but I assert 40,000 schisms of christianity are on the critical list.

The old coots will be beating each other over the heads with their canes and walkers in the name of jeebus.