Detective Terence Avery Green.
March 4, 2015. Fulton County Police Department, Georgia.

Quote:Detective Terence Green was shot and killed from ambush as he and other officers responded to reports of shots fired inside a house near the intersection of Chastain Way and Parks Trail at approximately 1:00 am.


The subject who lived in the home was known to police through frequent contacts with the department. Responding officers were unable to locate him inside the home and began searching the neighborhood after receiving additional calls stating the man was attempting to get into nearby homes.

As officers checked the area the man opened fire on them from a concealed position in the dark and fog. Detective Green was struck in the back of the head and another officer's duty belt and radio was struck as they attempted to seek cover. Other officers returned fired, wounding the man, and then took him into custody.

  https://www.odmp.org/officer/22400-detec...very-green



Detective Brian Moore
May 4, 2015. New York City Police Department, New York

Quote:Police Officer Brian Moore succumbed to a gunshot wound sustained two days earlier when he attempted to question a suspicious person in Queens.


Officer Moore and his partner were assigned to a plainclothes Anti-Crime Unit and on patrol in an unmarked car when they observed a male walking on a sidewalk and adjusting an object in his waistband. The officers pulled alongside the subject and asked him what he was carrying. The subject responded by pulling out a handgun and opening fire into the vehicle, striking Officer Moore in the face.

Officer Moore was transported to a Jamaica Hospital where he remained unconscious until passing away two days later.

https://www.odmp.org/officer/22468-detec...rian-moore

And people die and get killed every day, welcome to earth. Why should I give any more or less of a fuck about cops as opposed to people who die due to poverty in the United States?

Cops work to sustain this system for its elite, a class which none of us here belong to. So I really see no compelling reason to give a shit. They took a job, they knew the risks, they got paid reasonably well (with amazing benefits for them and their families). 

All I see here is dumb, redneck, nationalistic idiocy. 

#fuckthepolice

(May 16, 2015 at 10:26 am)francismjenkins Wrote: And people die and get killed every day, welcome to earth. Why should I give any more or less of a fuck about cops as opposed to people who die due to poverty in the United States?

Well I was getting ready to disagree after reading the first sentence but your example choice is a good one. It still misses the key difference that cops who die in the line of duty more likely think they are serving the public. (I know, you disagree about that.) But people who die of poverty related causes serve your point well.

You can easily argue that they too are serving the common good by settling for so little so that the few can have so much and the ever smaller middle class can have what they do. Of course they aren't choosing to make this sacrifice, they are merely the victims of those who can afford influence in the service of their gluttony.

(May 16, 2015 at 10:26 am)francismjenkins Wrote: Cops work to sustain this system for its elite, a class which none of us here belong to. So I really see no compelling reason to give a shit. They took a job, they knew the risks, they got paid reasonably well (with amazing benefits for them and their families). 

That sounds as far off the mark for describing why most cops become cops, as the common Christian claim that most atheists just hate god. Since I don't like being told why I accept the label of atheist, I'm not going to presume to tell policemen why they do the work they do.

It is possible to see cops as inadvertent lackies of the 1%, like so many others. I wouldn't assume they are equal partners with the 1%'ers. You can work for them in the fields or work for them in the big house. But only republicans are gullible enough to think they are their partners.

(May 15, 2015 at 5:07 pm)Saxmoof Wrote: If you want to make the case that not all cops are bad then fair enough, debatable, but fair enough.

"Debatable"?

You realize that all one has to do to demolish such a simplistic and asinine argument as "all cops are bad" is to produce one cop who is not bad, right?

You may as well argue for a flat earth. Not all cops are bad folks out to shoot minorities. I know this because I know a few of them.

(May 16, 2015 at 10:43 am)whateverist Wrote: ...

(May 16, 2015 at 10:26 am)francismjenkins Wrote: Cops work to sustain this system for its elite, a class which none of us here belong to. So I really see no compelling reason to give a shit. They took a job, they knew the risks, they got paid reasonably well (with amazing benefits for them and their families). 

That sounds as far off the mark for describing why most cops become cops, as the common Christian claim that most atheists just hate god.  Since I don't like being told why I accept the label of atheist, I'm not going to presume to tell policemen why they do the work they do.

It is possible to see cops as inadvertent lackies of the 1%, like so many others.  I wouldn't assume they are equal partners with the 1%'ers.  You can work for them in the fields or work for them in the big house.  But only republicans are gullible enough to think they are their partners.

First, I think it is perfectly obvious that different people have different motives for becoming cops. Some really want to 'protect abnd serve,' and some want to bust some heads without getting into legal trouble for doing so, and, being cowards, want an unfair advantage in the fight.

My father-in-law is a retired police officer. He would tell you the same thing I just did.

(As an aside, if every cop were like my father-in-law, we would not be having this discussion at all. We would instead by asking, why are all those cops such strange fellows? Sure, they do their job very well, but....)


Second, I could be mistaken, but I believe that francismjenkins meant that that was what cops are doing, not that that is what they intend to be doing.

Right, I obviously meant that policing and the system which supports it, protects the elite in this country (as should be implicitly obvious, since I cannot possibly know the individual motives of all the people who choose to become cops, although I'm quite sure that for the most part, it's not to protect the elite).

The maxim 99% is illustrative. One wealthy person against a crowd of 99 people .... there's only one thing preventing the crowd from ripping his face off (if they so please) ... the state and its henchmen, police forces.

In other words, capitalism requires coercion and violence to sustain itself (it couldn't survive without violence). Granted, some forms of socialism require the same, and central planning is terribly inefficient, but this is a common straw man (there are endless variations on the theme of socialism, some of which are adamant about voluntary participation and non-coercion, and there's many possible hybrid theories as well which attempt to take advantage of the best parts of socialism and capitalism, and toss out the shitty aspects of both economic approaches). Anyways ....  I digress

(May 16, 2015 at 11:52 am)Parkers Tan Wrote:

(May 15, 2015 at 5:07 pm)Saxmoof Wrote: If you want to make the case that not all cops are bad then fair enough, debatable, but fair enough.

"Debatable"?

You realize that all one has to do to demolish such a simplistic and asinine argument as "all cops are bad" is to produce one cop who is not bad, right?

You may as well argue for a flat earth. Not all cops are bad folks out to shoot minorities. I know this because I know a few of them.

True, I should've said "if you want to make the case that most cops are good... etc."

That's what I meant, lazy phrasing

But when people defending cops say "not all cops are bad" which is the argument i was parroting - they're not saying that they're all bad apart from this one good one i managed to find that lives near me, they're saying that most are good and that it's just a few bad apples we should not focus on so much - that's what's debatable

(May 16, 2015 at 11:51 pm)Saxmoof Wrote: True, I should've said "if you want to make the case that most cops are good... etc."

That's what I meant, lazy phrasing

But when people defending cops say "not all cops are bad" which is the argument i was parroting - they're not saying that they're all bad apart from this one good one i managed to find that lives near me, they're saying that most are good and that it's just a few bad apples we should not focus on so much - that's what's debatable

Fair enough, and well-spoken -- forgive my tendency to pedantry.

As far as "bad", I'd agree that those cops who sit silent while another cop does something illegal definitely have dirty hands. And that's too many of them.

"Most"? Definitely debatable.

Judging from my personal run-ins with police not related to me (and there's been a few and then some), most are decent guys in the situations we were in -- mainly traffic tickets, no violent crimes, no drugs. I've had enough cops be assholes to me even under those circumstances that I know a good proportion of them are either badge-heavy, jaded by continual run-ins with dipshits, or looking for a game to run. But I've also had them let me go without paperwork when they had me dead-to-rights.

I don't really care for the either-or thing that happens with public opinions about policing, and I sure as hell don't care for generalizations.

There'll always be cops that sincerely want to serve their community as that's the whole point of the police force, there's just a lack of accountability that also makes the job attractive to assholes who want the power and the respect with none of the responsibility

Indeed. And the "thin blue line"/code of silence shit has to end. It is that which is causing the problems we're seeing nowadays.