Is religion child abuse?

[Skipper]

Firstly I think we would all agree that if I told a child to behave and that if he didn't I would lock him in my basement and torment and punish him for the rest of his life, that would be a form of child abuse, no?

So where does religion get it's free reign to do just this to children? They don't know what religion they believe in, until they are told by their parents, who were likely just told by their own parents in a never ending cycle of tormenting children.

How does religion and more directly the religious people on this forum justify this form of mental torture and do people think there is anything we can do about it?

[Paul the Human]

I think it is abusive in a manner of speaking, but the vast majority of the time, the indoctrination of children is done unconsciously (as the parents truly believe what they are teaching) and is not meant to be malicious in any way. Religion has the concept of 'the carrot and the stick' built right in, so along with the threats of damnation come the promises of salvation. For that reason, I don't think it can be considered abuse, really. Abuse is done intentionally, with malice, and/or through neglect. Religious indoctrination, even though it contains elements of fear mongering and threats, is done with the best of intentions (most of the time). At least, that's my take on it.

We'll probably never see religion disappear from our little world, so maybe the best we can hope for is that people begin concentrating on the positive aspects (promises of love and salvation) and stop threatening their kids with damnation if they tell a white lie.

[Anomalocaris]

@Skipper : Religion is not necessarily child abuse, but it very easily and very frequently lapse into child abuse. So one might draw an analogy and say it might not be rape in itself, nor does it always rape at every opportunity, but it is a registered sex offender.

@Paul : Many forms of child abuse were not done with what perpetrator would consider malice. Those who pray in lieu of giving their sick children available medical care often commits the supreme child abuse of child murder. Those who prevent their children from receiving basic secular education out of religious convictions commits abuse that will scar the entire course of the child's life. In both of those cases the abuse came from no intentional malice. But in both of those cases, I would find it impossible to avoid condamning the acts as most aggregious of child abuse and demanding the severest punishments on the prepetrators to reduce the occurrence of such behavior amongst religiously afflicted parents.

[Paul the Human]

@Paul : Many forms of child abuse were not done with what perpetrator would consider malice. Those who pray in lieu of giving their sick children available medical care often commits the supreme child abuse of child murder. Those who prevent their children from receiving basic secular education out of religious convictions commits abuse that will scar the entire course of the child's life. In both of those cases the abuse came from no intentional malice. But in both of those cases, I would find it impossible to avoid condamning the acts as most aggregious of child abuse and demanding the severest punishments on the prepetrators to reduce the occurrence of such behavior amongst religiously afflicted parents.

I agree. But the fact that something can and does happen, doesn't mean that it usually happens. In the majority of cases, parents that teach their kids to believe the same religious teachings that they themselves believe is not 'child abuse', although it can be argued that some of those teachings are mentally and emotionally frightening (the carrot and the stick technique). The majority of 'Christian parents' indoctrinate their children with the very best of intentions and while it can be a form of abuse in some cases, I don't see any reason to think that it is in most cases.

P.S. Obviously withholding medical care and proper education qualify as abuse, but most people don't do those things. It's a quite a generalization to claim that all childhood religious indoctrination equates to abuse.

[lilyannerose]

My own thinking is that I would find the hard core fundies to be psychologically and physically abusive to their children as it is sanctioned. I just found this disgusting article on some of the discipline advocated for children by one couple Michael and Debi Pearl, in fact they made over $1Million on the sale of their books and DVDs on disciplining children, one technique that caught my eye was "A length of quarter-inch plumbing supply line is a "real attention-getter which resulted in "7-year-old Lydia Schatz, an apparent victim of repeated beating with -- as it turns out -- quarter-inch plumbing supply line. Her parents, Kevin and Elizabeth Schatz of Paradise, Calif., who reportedly called 911 to report that she was not breathing, stand charged with her murder."

http://www.salon.com/life/parenting/inde...reater_joy

The fundies have a big problem, as do several other institutions, of having stupid people as part of their network of believers who don't know how to engage in any analytical or critical thinking regarding actions they have been advised to take.

[Paul the Human]

Therein lies the real problem. While most Christian parents are not guilty of child abuse... religious teachings can, in some cases, be very abusive. And when it does become abusive, like the fundies example you gave, it is often pretty heinous.

[Rayaan]

I agree with what Paul the Human said. Parents teach religion to their kids with a good intention, so we can't really call it "child abuse."

My parents weren't too strict about religion though. They only taught me the basics of Islam. Then after growing up, around the time of high school, I became an atheist for a short time. I didn't believe in God and I didn't believe in any religions at all. I thought Islam was just like any other religion. But 2 or 3 years later, I taught myself more about Islam and the history of the Quran and then my lost faith was slowly coming back to me (after gaining more knowledge). My parents weren't involved behind any of this because I learned about Islam by myself. And I surely never felt any type of a mental torture in being a Muslim.

Would I teach religion to my kids in the future (if I have any)? Yes, and still they'll be able to think freely and make their own decisions on religion just like I did myself.

[Skipper]

Would I teach religion to my kids in the future (if I have any)? Yes, and still they'll be able to think freely and make their own decisions on religion just like I did myself.

Except of course if they decide to leave Islam and speak out against it. Then you would support killing them to save them from a possibly worse punishment of the fires of hell

[Justtristo]

I think it is abusive in a manner of speaking, but the vast majority of the time, the indoctrination of children is done unconsciously (as the parents truly believe what they are teaching) and is not meant to be malicious in any way. Religion has the concept of 'the carrot and the stick' built right in, so along with the threats of damnation come the promises of salvation. For that reason, I don't think it can be considered abuse, really. Abuse is done intentionally, with malice, and/or through neglect. Religious indoctrination, even though it contains elements of fear mongering and threats, is done with the best of intentions (most of the time). At least, that's my take on it.

We'll probably never see religion disappear from our little world, so maybe the best we can hope for is that people begin concentrating on the positive aspects (promises of love and salvation) and stop threatening their kids with damnation if they tell a white lie.

I fully agree with your thoughts on this topic.

[Rwandrall]

The parents believe they are saving their children and making them better people by teaching them this stuff. This is not more child abuse than teaching them to be polite or to not cheat or steal. It's not really child abuse.