A question about original sin.

[fr0d0]

Why is it convoluted for me to toe the line, and rational for you to overstep it?

Because in deliberately ignoring the obvious you fall back on this concocted nonsense. There was the rational explanation, and there was you stepping over it.
I can fully appreciate the material world for what it is. & I don't need to dismiss other people's views to justify my own.

[C Rod]

There are many claims to truth my friend but only one is true.

Let me guess, yours is the true one?

I believe it to be very true. I find it very important as to be considered more. I find that what Jesus said is different than what anyone has ever said. I have found patterns in Confucius, Shakespeare, Ben. Franklin, Buddha, i found that there teachings or ideas are that of just intellectual men and i have often come up with their very concepts on my own. I find the religion to be set on a promise and thus a hope. I am also to share this belief i have with others because it is good, "I am sending you out like sheep among wolves. Therefore be as shrewd as snakes and as innocent as doves." Mat10:16 I also find that Bible prophesy is very interesting and should be taken mention, with also the prophesy that has come true already. I think the good it teaches is excellent influence of how i should lead my life. I find it to be the most true and peculiar of all the other religions. I truly believe faith is given to us by God and we just have to accept it .

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Now if i may, why must it be proven it is a belief?

If your "truth" is nothing more than a belief, then you really have no standing to claim that it is "the one truth". You don't know that - you have no way to know that. Belief is not equal to knowledge.

Believe whatever you want, I don't care. When you step over the line and profess your belief is THE ONE TRUTH, be prepared to get called on your bullshit and defend it - or STFU and GTFO. To do otherwise is intellectually dishonest.

What if say i believe it to be the one truth with the assurance of an old book, and i share this belief with you. The thing you want is to see God and then to be like ok now i get it but i find that very fake and selfish. We are arguing over belief and what you tell me of what you believe is just well informed speculation about grand coincidence that i find not true because it is not truth. My belief credits it as the one truth your just angry cause your on the outside. There all claims and as mush as know one wants to admit what we believe has to be the one truth or why believe, the thing is, it is the belief that is important not the claim we all claim to or are to scared to proclaim to for the one truth is irrelevant because we do not know it.

[Salty Amy]

It would all be fine if we weren't insisting in commitint the same sin over and over again. The old book is pretty clear, the original sin has nothing to do with apples..

The great sin is Curiosity, the horrible sin of seeking knowledge! Eva talked dumb-ass Adam into biting the fruit and look where we are now... an atheist forum!

[The Grand Nudger]

I believe does not equal It is

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Why is it convoluted for me to toe the line, and rational for you to overstep it?

Because in deliberately ignoring the obvious you fall back on this concocted nonsense. There was the rational explanation, and there was you stepping over it.
I can fully appreciate the material world for what it is. & I don't need to dismiss other people's views to justify my own.

What are you using "the obvious" as shorthand for in this instance Frodo?

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Statler, just finished reading the debate. I don't know if we're actually talking about the same debate though, should I pm you the link? To be sure?

[Statler Waldorf]

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No worries, I'll just rip it off the web, whats the name of the debate? Mormons make a claim to the truth as well, back to the drawing board CRod.

There are many claims to truth my friend but only one is true.

Absolutely right, now prove that yours is that one. Evidence?

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LOL, you know I tried to buy that debate from Barts site...couldn't find a link, and here I am with my money out.

and then.

http://www.aomin.org/catalog/product_inf...cts_id=868

I find these wonderful people, James White, director. Are you sure you paid Ehrman for this debate..lol? There are apparently two of these, The debate you're referencing is the one with White yes? (NVM, found it in PDF, why did you pay for this?)

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You couldn't find it from Bart? I know he is selling it, or was when I got my hands on it at least. I will get it from White's site next time though; his are far more affordable because he is not in it for profit.

[The Grand Nudger]

Okay.

Was there a particular part of Whites argument that you found particularly compelling?

[Cinjin]

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Why such hostility? I see no need for it myself. It's not a matter of evidence, it's a matter of logic. You keep treating God like he is a person, why would you even bother doing this? I just don't understand where you get your concept of justice.

Nor I yours. When your argument fails, as it always does, you simply change the definition of a word to suit your agenda. You are pathetic. Doesn't matter. We've had this argument before and I'm not going to have it again. I remember the first time your final conclusion went something like this:

God isn't a human so our definition of justice does not suit him. God has his own justice and it is perfect. God can cast billions of people into hell because he has the "justice for deities" version of justice.

Do not waste my time further with this. I have avoided putting you on the ignore list, but I'll be happy to do it if you want to beat this particular subject to death again. Also. What hostility? Asking someone in this forum why they are hostile is most often a dodge and a cop-out. It's placating and condescending and clearly I had a very valid point that you cannot address - so you ignore it and try to discredit me by playing the martyr and then insult my intelligence by simply saying, "I just don't understand where you get your concept of justice."

You are not hated on these forums because you are a christian. You are hated because you manipulate, condescend, deny, dodge and outright lie.

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Please give me an instance where I have lied as to avoid bearing false witness, thanks.

Yeah, last time we talked I presented a valid logical syllogism as to why God is just by nature and you just through a hissy fit about it. Ok, so for the purpose of the discussion we can use whatever definition of justice you want, but please provide it. Thanks.

.... and HERE(see bold) is that instance you requested. Thank you. That'll be all.

[Cinjin]

[Minimalist]

Minimalist Wrote:

Quote:Adam was mankind's representative so when he sinned we all sinned.



I didn't vote for the fucker. Don't blame me.



That doesn’t matter, if congress declares war on a nation, even if I didn’t vote for those members of congress who voted to declare war I am still at war with that nation because congress represents me. Either way, you wouldn’t have done any better in Adam’s place.

Of course, congress is real and Adam is a fucking fairy tale. Try to remember that, Waldork.

[Anymouse]

The question about original sin puzzled me exceedingly as a child. I loved to learn (still do), but I could never understand why Adam and Eve were forbidden to eat the fruit of knowledge. Knowledge, that made you understand things, made you wiser, and this was to be forbidden? The god that asks it's followers to be ignorant is truly an asshole, knowledge will never be seen as sin by me.

The $64 question. Why would a loving God declare knowledge to be sinful? And if Adam and Eve had subsequentially eaten from the Tree of Life after the Tree of Knowledge, instead of sewing fig leaves together because they were shamed by the bodies God created, would they have lived forever with knowledge?

Why is Christianity superior to other religions (forget atheism for a moment), other than its holy book says so (and it doesn't even say that, Christians just interpret it that way)?

The Principia Discordia says many things about life, the universe, and everything, and precious little of it makes sense. The difference here being the writers of Eris's holy book know the book to be nonsense. Believers in the Bible (as opposed to readers of the Bible) do not seem to understand, or mind, that the Bible makes no more sense than the Principia. At least Discordians are honest about their religious beliefs: they know they are BS from the first to the last word of the book.

James.