DNA Proves Existence of a Designer

[Amarok]

you don't know therefore "atheism

Nope we don't know therefore we don't know but their is no reason to  appeal to a god to fill the gap 

along with things popping out of nowhere

Straw man and I already commented on this 

and living things coming from nonliving. 

Something you never provided an objection too 

Congrats, that's just brilliant. Your whole premise is based on the optical outcome that some day you will die and become tasty worm food. 

So ?

Wow, now that's something to look forward to.

It's not a matter of looking forward

[T0 Th3 M4X]

You have literally given me nothing in return for all the explanations I and others have given, I have asked time and time again for a description of a god and how god did these things and you have given nothing.

Let me say again that to say god did something is not enough if you provide no evidence for that or even a good definition of what a god is.

As far as I can see god is just a cover for you not knowing something.

You don't know, therefore god.

You produce nothing, and you have nothing.  I know therefore "God", you don't know therefore "atheism",

I don't find the idea of god convincing which makes I don't know therefore atheism is a perfectly valid position.
That is all.
Let me break it down for you.
You say "god exists" I say "what is a god?" and you wont tell me.
"look its in dictionaries" you say "But they are vague and incoherent what do you think a god is?" I ask and you say nothing. You wont even set out your position. How am I supposed to find that compelling?

I think that you don't actually know what you think a god is supposed to be. You just heard he word and liked it.

along with things popping out of nowhere, and living things coming from nonliving. Congrats, that's just brilliant. Your whole premise is based on the optical outcome that some day you will die and become tasty worm food.  Wow, now that's something to look forward to.  One thing is true, we all find what we seek in one form or another.  Good luck.

Well I did present material things popping out of nowhere that is a demonstrable fact and there are scientifically viable ideas of how living things could have developed from non-living things that are being investigated, remember science is not finished yet and we do not pretend to know everything, which is where we diverge from theists who do pretend to know everything but do not have anything to back up their unlikely ideas.

But what I can say is that whatever caused life to exist and the universe to begin will turn out to be natural processes just like every other thing that was once attributed to god has turned out to be.

And lets look at what you say is evidence for god.
The existence of a universe and life coming from non-life.

This does not match with the homosexual hating, virgin impregnating heaven controlling god of the bible.
And lets not also forget that god was NOT ALONE. He had the angels of various different orders The sepraphim, cherubin and nephalim some of whom rebelled against him in what sounds like battlefield earth.


Why cant you see that this is all just an old civilisations creation myth, its bleeding obvious that the god idea is just a silly hangover from the past.

I don't owe you a special definition.  If the dictionary isn't good enough for you, then no problem.  On to something else.  Maybe the problem is you "thinking" too much and not listening.  I'm not the one who is a problem with God being defined or understanding His existence.  If you're fine with that, then more power to ya.  I'm not going to go around in circles until you agree to a specific definition, because it's a pointless endeavor.  You can't get to step B, when you're still fussing that step A wasn't fair.
I don't care about ideas you imagined.  Just show me.  A simple video and done.  If it happens and appears to be legit, you win.   If you don't want to do that (or can't), just let me know and we can both move on to something else.  No hurt feelings on my end either way.

[Amarok]

I don't care about ideas you imagined.  Just show me.  A simple video and done.  If it happens and appears to be legit, you win.   If you don't want to do that (or can't), just let me know and we can both move on to something else.  No hurt feelings on my end either way.

This silly line of reasoning has already failed you. No video is required .

---

I'm not going to go around in circles until you agree to a specific definition, because it's a pointless endeavor. 

Not his job

[T0 Th3 M4X]

I don't care about ideas you imagined.  Just show me.  A simple video and done.  If it happens and appears to be legit, you win.   If you don't want to do that (or can't), just let me know and we can both move on to something else.  No hurt feelings on my end either way.

This silly line of reasoning has already failed you. No video is required .

---

I'm not going to go around in circles until you agree to a specific definition, because it's a pointless endeavor. 

Not his job

It hasn't failed me.  If he has nothing, then there's nothing for me to consider, so on to something different.

Didn't say it was his job.  Just as it isn't my job to assume he knows what he's talking about, but I'm at least willing to consider it if he has something to show.

[Amarok]

This silly line of reasoning has already failed you. No video is required .

---

Not his job

It hasn't failed me.  If he has nothing, then there's nothing for me to consider, so on to something different.

Didn't say it was his job.  Just as it isn't my job to assume he knows what he's talking about, but I'm at least willing to consider it if he has something to show.

Actually it has and he does not have to fulfill your irrational requests

---

And no video is  required

---

Just show me.  A simple video and done.

Or we could ignore your irrational request and point and laugh while high fiving all the biochemists who are working tirelessly on Abiogenesis and All the philosophers and physics who have no issue with  the concepts of cosmology you reject and you can continue raving about evil conspiracies to "brainwash people" and demanding "video's "

[pocaracas]

Yes, you were working with those people, but did you talk with them about what you were experiencing?
Or did you self-analyze? Doesn't every professional know that self-analyzing/self-diagnosing is typically a bad idea?


"Something" that, from what little you describe makes me wonder if it was not some sleep related thing... combined with an invisible&remote way of conducting electrical signals 📶


You didn't have a mysterious something to deal with when you were learning about Buddhism, so you never thought of it as an answer to any something.
That you sought Christianity in an attempt to answer your something is revealing of your predisposition towards it... or even prior engagement with it. Which makes me wonder as to why you say that you became a christian after this event. How did you see yourself, religiously, prior to that?
How was your upbringing, in terms of contact with religions? On what sort of society did you grow up?


Same here, man!  

Oh I spoke with them about it.  No need to self-diagnose.

Good, good!

Nope, wasn't some sleep-related electrical signals.

No batteries included!

How did I see myself before that?  Pretty much the same as I do now.  More times than not I look for natural explanations, but I also try not to carry any specific bias that would inhibit understanding in one form or another.  But then again, I would say I work from a more well-defined framework as to how I view the world around me.

You'll just have to take my word for it, but I'm probably once of the most annoyingly analytical person you could ever meet.  Even if I didn't want to be that way, it's just how I am.  I blame it on learning to play Chess when I was younger, and those same principles apply to life.  The strongest position to operate from is in the middle, then you work outward accordingly.

So.... are you saying that you were already christian?

Did you grow up around religion?  What is your outlook on life?

I grew up with little religion in my life.
What little I got came from my grandmother, on the few occasions that I was with her.
No one else said anything otherwise, so I assumed that to be true and generally accepted... then things started not making sense for religion and, for a while, I actually thought I was the only non-believer in the world.
Nowadays, my outlook on life is that it's worth living. It's full of beautiful things to be enjoyed and appreciated... no one seems to be enjoying anything after dying, nor before living, so this is my one chance at it and I want to make the most of it.

[downbeatplumb]

I don't owe you a special definition.  If the dictionary isn't good enough for you, then no problem.  On to something else.  Maybe the problem is you "thinking" too much and not listening.  I'm not the one who is a problem with God being defined or understanding His existence.  If you're fine with that, then more power to ya.  I'm not going to go around in circles until you agree to a specific definition, because it's a pointless endeavor.  You can't get to step B, when you're still fussing that step A wasn't fair.
I don't care about ideas you imagined.

 

If you cant say what you believe in in a coherent way then perhaps you don't really know.

Just show me.  A simple video and done.  If it happens and appears to be legit, you win.   If you don't want to do that (or can't), just let me know and we can both move on to something else.  No hurt feelings on my end either way.

[/quote]


A video on what particularly.

Things popping into existence ok then.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3xLuZNKhlY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yB8CBEFDNC8

life coming from chemicals ok then.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1xnYFCZ9Yg


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1xnYFCZ9Yg

[T0 Th3 M4X]

It hasn't failed me.  If he has nothing, then there's nothing for me to consider, so on to something different.

Didn't say it was his job.  Just as it isn't my job to assume he knows what he's talking about, but I'm at least willing to consider it if he has something to show.

Actually it has and he does not have to fulfill your irrational requests

---

And no video is  required

---

Just show me.  A simple video and done.

Or we could ignore your irrational request and point and laugh while high fiving all the biochemists who are working tirelessly on Abiogenesis and All the philosophers and physics who have no issue with  the concepts of cosmology  you reject and you can continue raving about evil conspiracies to "brainwash people" and demanding "video's "

Either he has something or he doesn't.  If he does, then he can either show it or not show it.  My concern is solely on his ability to show it.  If not, no hard feelings and I will move on.  No big deal.  If you think that is an irrational approach, fair enough, but that is your opinion, but to me I see no reason to make the matter overly complicated.  If he can show me, then I can observe it.  If he can't show me, then I can't observe it.  My response is already predetermined because I already stated it.  He shows it, I observe it, it appears authentic, he wins.

---

Oh I spoke with them about it.  No need to self-diagnose.

Good, good!

Nope, wasn't some sleep-related electrical signals.

No batteries included!

How did I see myself before that?  Pretty much the same as I do now.  More times than not I look for natural explanations, but I also try not to carry any specific bias that would inhibit understanding in one form or another.  But then again, I would say I work from a more well-defined framework as to how I view the world around me.

You'll just have to take my word for it, but I'm probably once of the most annoyingly analytical person you could ever meet.  Even if I didn't want to be that way, it's just how I am.  I blame it on learning to play Chess when I was younger, and those same principles apply to life.  The strongest position to operate from is in the middle, then you work outward accordingly.

So.... are you saying that you were already christian?

Did you grow up around religion?  What is your outlook on life?

I grew up with little religion in my life.
What little I got came from my grandmother, on the few occasions that I was with her.
No one else said anything otherwise, so I assumed that to be true and generally accepted... then things started not making sense for religion and, for a while, I actually thought I was the only non-believer in the world.
Nowadays, my outlook on life is that it's worth living. It's full of beautiful things to be enjoyed and appreciated... no one seems to be enjoying anything after dying, nor before living, so this is my one chance at it and I want to make the most of it.

No I wasn't already a Christian.

You have a similar outlook on life as I do.  There is beauty everywhere.

Our big difference seems to be that what you see as an end, I see as a gateway to the next great adventure.

As a Christian, that in a lot of ways is how we understand Jesus.  He came here, went through extreme circumstances like we often do, got chased, beaten, mocked, and eventually died.  And in all of it, it wasn't a loss, but the winning move.

---

I don't owe you a special definition.  If the dictionary isn't good enough for you, then no problem.  On to something else.  Maybe the problem is you "thinking" too much and not listening.  I'm not the one who is a problem with God being defined or understanding His existence.  If you're fine with that, then more power to ya.  I'm not going to go around in circles until you agree to a specific definition, because it's a pointless endeavor.  You can't get to step B, when you're still fussing that step A wasn't fair.
I don't care about ideas you imagined.

 

If you cant say what you believe in in a coherent way then perhaps you don't really know.

Just show me.  A simple video and done.  If it happens and appears to be legit, you win.   If you don't want to do that (or can't), just let me know and we can both move on to something else.  No hurt feelings on my end either way.

A video on what particularly.

Things popping into existence ok then.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3xLuZNKhlY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yB8CBEFDNC8

life coming from chemicals ok then.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1xnYFCZ9Yg


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1xnYFCZ9Yg
[/quote]

Video 1 - Was a guy talking to another guy and looking at a computer simulation.  Interesting, but didn't see any rocks or any other new matter in the video, just conjecture
Video 2-  Talks about friction.  Interesting, but didn't see any rocks or any other new matter in the video.
Video 3 - Conjecture about how things may have happened in regard to strands of RNA.  Semi-interesting but presumes something that isn't necessary.  Still no rocks or any other new matter appearing in the video.
Video 4 - Same response as video 3, because it was the same video.

[pocaracas]

Good, good!


No batteries included!


So.... are you saying that you were already christian?


I grew up with little religion in my life.
What little I got came from my grandmother, on the few occasions that I was with her.
No one else said anything otherwise, so I assumed that to be true and generally accepted... then things started not making sense for religion and, for a while, I actually thought I was the only non-believer in the world.
Nowadays, my outlook on life is that it's worth living. It's full of beautiful things to be enjoyed and appreciated... no one seems to be enjoying anything after dying, nor before living, so this is my one chance at it and I want to make the most of it.

No I wasn't already a Christian.

Which makes me wonder... How did you identify yourself, in the religiosity/spirituality spectrum?

You have a similar outlook on life as I do.  There is beauty everywhere.

Well.... not entirely everywhere. There's plenty of crap in this world that I'd rather wasn't there.

Our big difference seems to be that what you see as an end, I see as a gateway to the next great adventure.

I have no reason to think there is any adventure beyond that gate.
Believe me, I would love to know that there was such an adventure. But I don't. And I don't see how anyone on this Earth can know about it. That makes your point of view little more than wishful thinking, don't you think?

As a Christian, that in a lot of ways is how we understand Jesus.  He came here, went through extreme circumstances like we often do, got chased, beaten, mocked, and eventually died.  And in all of it, it wasn't a loss, but the winning move.

It's amazing how getting chased, beaten, mocked and killed became something to aspire to.
Suffering is to be avoided, in my opinion. And, if I can, I'll try to avoid it befalling upon others.

But Jesus, according to the story, didn't stay dead for long. He respawned and immediately obtained the cheat code for god-mode and then, instead of sticking around, guiding humanity so that no more idiocy would come to pass, he buggered off, flew off... then, 600 years later, Mohamed came and idiocy followed... and he too flew off... Myths tend to repeat certain themes, you see? It's a way to keep the hero "alive", when he's not really around.

In Christianity, some spirituality, some guidance is totally valid and it's been found to help in putting minds at ease. But that doesn't mean that the whole story is true. Nor that the "magical" (or, if you prefer, miraculous) bits are true.

[T0 Th3 M4X]

No I wasn't already a Christian.

Which makes me wonder... How did you identify yourself, in the religiosity/spirituality spectrum?

You have a similar outlook on life as I do.  There is beauty everywhere.

Well.... not entirely everywhere. There's plenty of crap in this world that I'd rather wasn't there.

Our big difference seems to be that what you see as an end, I see as a gateway to the next great adventure.

I have no reason to think there is any adventure beyond that gate.
Believe me, I would love to know that there was such an adventure. But I don't. And I don't see how anyone on this Earth can know about it. That makes your point of view little more than wishful thinking, don't you think?

As a Christian, that in a lot of ways is how we understand Jesus.  He came here, went through extreme circumstances like we often do, got chased, beaten, mocked, and eventually died.  And in all of it, it wasn't a loss, but the winning move.

It's amazing how getting chased, beaten, mocked and killed became something to aspire to.
Suffering is to be avoided, in my opinion. And, if I can, I'll try to avoid it befalling upon others.

But Jesus, according to the story, didn't stay dead for long. He respawned and immediately obtained the cheat code for god-mode and then, instead of sticking around, guiding humanity so that no more idiocy would come to pass, he buggered off, flew off... then, 600 years later, Mohamed came and idiocy followed... and he too flew off... Myths tend to repeat certain themes, you see? It's a way to keep the hero "alive", when he's not really around.

In Christianity, some spirituality, some guidance is totally valid and it's been found to help in putting minds at ease. But that doesn't mean that the whole story is true. Nor that the "magical" (or, if you prefer, miraculous) bits are true.

- Before, I would say I was more ignorant, but not intentionally.  Even when I'm skeptical of something, I try not to rule it out, but I don't necessarily go out of my way either, just because there's too much to do in life, and I can't focus on everything.  Just like people claiming there is a Bigfoot running around somewhere.  If there is, I'm ignorant of it, but that doesn't mean there isn't.  I'm not an enthusiast for chasing Bigfoot as a hobby, so unless someone gives me a reason to believe, besides a blurry camera picture or video, then I'll just continue on with other things. If they are right, great, I'll look at what they want to show me.  If not, great.  Glad they're doing something meaningful to them.

- There are a lot of things in this world that I wish weren't there as well, but there can still be beauty in those things.  Like finding beauty in what we view to make a mistake.  Someone lays a hot coal on a table and a child places their hand on it.  It's not a good experience for the child at that moment, but he or she knows not to touch hot coals in the future, or anything that might have been subject to large amounts of heat energy.  Not only do they know, they can tell others not to touch hot coals.  But that little singe kept someone else from being burned severely based on their experience and the knowledge they shared from it.  This is kinda what I meant before.  I tend to be very analytical and I like to be somewhere in the center of things. Knowledge is always viewed as a good thing, even when the information is negative.  It allows us all to act accordingly.

- I understand how you view Jesus dying and then he's back.  Yep, would seem like an oddity at face value.  But it wasn't just that.  It was like that coal I was just speaking of.  At face value it seems bad that the child burned themselves.  When Jesus died, it was very similar.  Someone died a brutal death because others failed to see their value, and as such felt they had removed the problem.  The thing is, he wasn't the problem, they were.  They got what they wanted, and in return he offered what they needed.  It's not that he had to die, but that he chose to.  I think comparing it all to a bridge going across a gap would be a good comparison.  He became that bridge.  Anybody can cross, but nobody is forced to.

I won't go around telling anybody they have to believe what I do.  What I can do is be willing to share why I believe the way I do.  What they do with that is up to them.  Yay or nay, they can be my friend regardless, and if they tell me not to talk to them about it, then I respect that.