What if we're all wrong though?

[Scented Nectar]

@SN- In post 94 you quoted 2 questions I asked and didn't answer either of them, nor haven't in the myriad of pages of our conversations, they're yes or no questions or multiple choice. Here they are again, plus the one you breezed over (probably because I forgot teh ? , my bad).
a-does the concept of the Christian God from the Bible have only amoral character traits?

I suppose all the 'begat' chapters are amoral, in that they are neither moral nor immoral, but for the rest? There are a very few minor good moral traits, such as a reference to the rule taken from other people's philosophies (the empathy one - do unto others...), but the majority of god's traits are highly immoral from a human perspective. Those traits have caused, and continue to cause, a lot of harm, misery, pain and suffering, both mental and physical. They are not at all good guides for human peace and happiness.

b-Do you deny the culpability of man to use God's creations for evil or do you blame God for the actions of evil?

Evil is an opinion, not an actual fixed entity. I don't believe in gods, so I don't blame any for evil. If the abrahamic god were real though, I would think he was a very immoral, evil creep, and I like to point out to believers why I think their main bible book character is such an evil creep. I blame humans individually, or sometimes as groups (such as those claiming to be following god-commands), for certain preventable or unnecessary acts that are cruel, malicious, etc. Evil is an opinion word for me, just like cruel and malicious are, and I often use them almost interchangeably. Evil is my opinion about a decision that another human makes when I think they should know full well that they are intentionally, and unnecessarily, harming others and not stopping themselves from doing it. I use the word as an adjective usually, but when I use it as a noun, I just mean a bunch of evil things collectively, such as 'the bible is one big cesspool of evil'.

c-How does either of the above equate to 50% omnipresent regardless of the answer?

I was just throwing a number out there of half and half to avoid the possible side issue of comparing how much good vs evil there is in the world. I don't think either exists as a measurable thing. They are emotion based opinions and can easily fluctuate all the time as to how much of either you feel is in your life/world. Also, the same act/behaviour/situation is often seen extremely differently between different people as to where it is on the good vs evil scale.

[Ramsin.Kh]

@ Ramsin.. uhhmm .. I don't know what that was.

What I've simply meant is that if there is no room for pleasure so there is no room for pain.

How do I get God to guide me? If you can take a second away from your selfish wants, allow for the possibility that God can and will be a force that exists in your life, and soften your heart to God you might hear him knocking and then you just have to open the door [/end requested preaching]

You're maybe pointing to meditation. I wonder what do you exactly mean by "selfish wants"?
A person who is struggling to reach his/her own desires and to get rid of his/her own fears has conflicts in his/her mind. If the person stops the conflicts of his/her mind, then the person should be selfless, and such a person simply follows his/her natural instincts.

[Minimalist]

I don't attribute the good things men do to God, but to men, nor do I attribute the bad things men do to God, just to men.

You just made your god redundant, tack.

[theophilus]

To be honest even if I were wrong I'd rather be in Hell than Heaven. I don't want to be kneeling at the feet of God. God just doesn't seem like the kind of person I'd like to hang out with.

When it comes to kneeling before God it won't make any difference whether you are in Heaven or Hell. Here is what the Bible says in Philippians 2:10, "At the name of Jesus every knee shall bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth.

[Purple Rabbit]

Ad 1. Perhaps I misunderstood identiy statement. God (noun) is (identifier) Love(noun). correct? God (noun) is a (identifier) wrathfull (adjective) God (noun). God (noun) hates (verb) Fags (noun sorry if this offends :S any1). My point was there are few places in the Bible where God is actually described with an identifier.

Yeah the bible really sucks as to what a god is.

Atheists pick all the adverbs, adjective, determiners and forget that the Bible is mostly prose. They pick out all the negative ones and say "That God's an a hole, f*** believing in that" when an actual description of the concept of God (specifically it's integral parts) should be in the identity criteria of the nouns identified to it.

Atheists pick? Have you lost 'm all? Theists attribute without reservation all sort of things to their god. The reason that we're having this discussion is because you are doing that yourself. Where does the bible say that god is love? You've made it up yourself or worse you are parotting some fabulating theist douchebag. Atheists are not the ones constructing some god.

I'm not dehumanizing anything it's my love and God's Love , 2 completely different things and they're capitonyms.

There is only love between sentient beings made of material on this planet.

Love of god is a vacuous concept based on confirmation bias. For a junkie it is in the syringe, but where is it for the kid with cancer? It seeks to dehumanize us by suggesting that our love is not complete and to dereason us with an imprint of myth and it completely fails to shed any light on what your god is.

Searched for "capitonyms" everywhere but it seems that that is a word you've invented yourself.

Ad 2. Trust that it proves nothing about material reality, agreed. However, my point was that a majority of atheists whom I've spoken to on this particular subject are cherry picking their own biased version of a literal, materialistic Bible, when the Bible as a whole has nothing to do with materialism, proof or literal interpretation.

They are confused by the many god concepts theists pick and choose randomly from their bibles, korans and what have you. But you can mend that all now by giving the one and only clear concise coherent consistent definition of that god of your bible..

[Rhizomorph13]

PR,

define:Capitonym works to find this:

Definitions of Capitonym on the Web:

•A capitonym is a word that changes its meaning (and sometimes pronunciation) when it is capitalized, and usually applies to capitalization due to proper nouns or eponyms. It is a portmanteau of the word capital with the suffix -onym. ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capitonym

•A word that changes sound and meaning when the case is changed; a case-sensitive word
en.wiktionary.org/wiki/capitonym

•capitonyms - A capitonym is a word that has a different meaning and may be pronounced differently in capitalized form. For example, "The Polish woman used polish on her nails."
teachertipstraining.suite101.com/article.cfm/linguistic_categories

•capitonyms - are identically spelled words that take on different menaing when capitalized;
twobenches.wordpress.com/tag/controlledvocabulary/

Rhizo

[Thor]

Ok so I'm having a shitty time at the present. How do I get God to guide me? Genuine question. I've been a catholic from birth til I was 16 (am now 46) not once in my life has God ever given me guidance or comfort or anything. I would love to have faith to fall back on-life would be a lot less scary if I had a sky daddy- but I never got a damn thing not once.

I've often brought up this exact point when dealing with believers. I tell them that I was once a believer but not once did this deity ever make his presence known to me. Not once did I ever experience any comfort from this being.

The believers then give me some crappola about how "God" was there for me, how he had his loving arms around me, only I didn't realize it.

Barf.

[Minimalist]

The believers then give me some crappola about how "God" was there for me, how he had his loving arms around me, only I didn't realize it.

Talk is cheap.....and god talk is cheapest of all.

[Thor]

Talk is cheap.....and god talk is cheapest of all.

Yeah, I tell these people how my grandmother died when I was 8. I tell them that that it would have been very comforting if this being had appeared to me and told me how my grandmother was now in heaven experiencing eternal happiness. But, of course, I received no such visit. They then typically give me some bilge about how "God" was there, helping me through this difficult time.

Yeah, right.

Makes me want to yak.

[Paul the Human]

My mother told me that if 'God' made himself apparent, it would negate the necessity of 'Faith'. As if that makes any kind of sense at all.