RE: Why so many "anti-feminists" in the atheist community?
January 2, 2015 at 4:38 am
(This post was last modified: January 2, 2015 at 4:40 am by Creed of Heresy.)
I'm not much of a fan of feminism anymore. I have no sexist viewpoints towards women but at the same time there's a point where one speaks of being objectively discriminated against, and subjectively discriminated against. The more radical, extreme feminists, the feminazis (or, as I prefer the term, ultrafeminists), are the ones who've crossed the line of objective discrimination, and entered subjective discrimination, wherein it's not a matter of them railing against things that oppress women as a whole, but rather are things that they personally FEEL are discriminating towards them SPECIFICALLY, while hiding it by saying it's something that discriminates women as a whole. The "rape culture" and "porn is objectifying women" claims are a very good example; both can be true, but those are not things that actually discriminate exclusively to women, but because the feminazis in question FEEL (and it is important that I emphasize that word) they do, therefore they consider it another crusade to undertake. "Feelings over facts" is a mantra I've come to find myself using as a way of deriding the stances others take when they think they are acting with moral righteousness about a social-rights issue, without actually thinking about the subject itself.
"Social rights" and "social justice" are topics that are rapidly becoming nothing more than trendy little things for today's "social media-savvy" hipsters to cling to to make themselves appear "open-minded" and "enlightened" and "accepting" and "progressive," while in fact being absolutely none of those things at all. Just because you dress a doll up very nice and pretty and with care and interest doesn't make it a person, even if it looks closely like one. Just because you feel something is bad in society and take a stance about it doesn't mean that you're an equal-rights champion, even though it might seem related to the big-time conversation topics that are actually taking place in the circles of equal-rights activism.
So, why are there so many anti-feminists in the atheist community? Because the feminist community began overstepping its bounds as to what it was objecting to. It began making up bullshit, and rather than working to try to rub out the line between men and women, it started replacing it with another that it has begun to gouge into the ground, only this time placed closer to the male side of the discussion...and to clarify the analogy, modern feminism of today, in its more well-known and vocal form, has dropped its idea of equality, and has instead taken to the idea that women should not only be treated equally; they should be treated as superiors, and men as inferiors to them. Is it a blatant thing? Is it loudly pronounced, or even just merely stated directly? No.
Not yet anyway. But it's getting there. It doesn't take a telescope to see that shit on the horizon. It's already there, and it's pretty visible.
Basically, feminism peaked and was hitting a point where egalitarianism was on the table at last, and the dialogue seemed open and sincere; men were realizing where they were overstepping their bounds and looking down on women and socially, it was becoming the norm for men to begin working to correct that behavior.
Maybe the feminist community saw that as a weakness to be exploited, maybe they became impatient and started acting in ways that would allow them to push even harder to try to get results faster, I dunno. All I do know is the ideas of "rape culture," originally valid in their protests, started to become ridiculous, absurd, and strangely self-deprecating...only, not humorously. The claims that all men are potential rapists if they jerk off to porn sounded comical at first, sure. Until it became clear that the claims were actually genuine. After that point, it was all downhill.
Feminism has largely achieved what it set out to do. The current issues still plaguing our society are being steadily improved. "Real" feminists understand this. The ones who are getting louder rather than finding comfort at taking their place at their opposite gender's sides as equals are the ones who do not wish for equality; they want the scales to not balance, but simply to switch the discrepancies. Their goals are not egalitarian; they are, dare I use such a strong word, supremacist. Sure, sure, they're not at that point yet. But whether or not they realize it, that's where they're going. I could go into detailing why a lot of modern feminism's stances are so absurd and anti-egalitarian, but there's no need. You either recognize why, and therefore are egalitarian, or you think they are valid, and are probably aware of just what the goal actually is with pushing those points as valid stances, and will not be dissuaded any more than ISIS will be from not killing innocents and being murderous sub-primate beasts, no matter how much logic or reasoning is demonstrated against them.
Atheists, not to sound too much like a bragging blowhard tooting the non-believer-community's horn, tend to be very quick on the draw when it comes to spotting bullshit. Not ALWAYS. But let's not be too modest; it's true that, by and large, atheists ARE a little better than the rest at calling bullshit when they see it. And to be frank, feminism is starting to develop a lot of bullshit. Feminism found a staunch ally in the atheist community when feminism was bringing up genuine points about equality, but you need only look at the history of the tumbleweed-infested ghost town that is Atheism+ to understand why that is no longer the case. Ultrafeminists stopped addressing prejudice and inequality towards their gender, and started trying to get their erstwhile friends and allies in the atheist community to help them "get back at the man (literally)," to do more than merely level the playing field, and to instead dig out the ground from underneath those evil creatures with their pen0rz and pr0nz, and pack it under the virtuous and righteous feet of the mighty female warrior.
In other words, they figured that since atheists are one of the largest minorities, if not THE single largest minority (at least in the US; I think we are the single largest minority, actually), and we're also a minority that is actually discriminated against just as much, if not more so than the other minorities in question, that they would play up the whole "we're buddies in being discriminated against" thing to try to give themselves more "firepower" as it were. Atheists, after all, are well-known for being more and more militant and aggressive these days as we find ourselves less and less capable of tolerating bullshit being unfairly treated as acceptable and factual. They mistook atheist aggression as being something they could relate to.
Thing is, ultrafeminists more or less have what they want. Militant atheists are all the more militant for the frustration of being stuck exactly where we were when we started out. We're not gaining many concessions, and the ones that we DO win, we win only by holding up the constitution and pointing to the Establishment Clause. Socially-speaking, we're still where we were 20, 30 years ago. We're still hated, we're still looked upon as inferior, immoral, or what have you by the theistic population at large (the population that is the vast, overwhelming majority, it should be mentioned). We have much more in common with the LGBT community than we do the feminist community now. So those who have more than we do now, asking for our help to not only undo the discrimination remaining but to actually enact discrimination in their favor, to give them even MORE...well, surprise, surprise; it didn't go over very well. So then when the atheist community at large didn't fall for the "rape culture" BS as a motivator to enable discrimination in a mirror-opposite form, the modern feminist community began accusing the atheist community of being anti-feminist...thus showing the modern ultrafeminists' true colors. There was no gender-based discrimination coming from the atheist community. The atheist community just simply called feminism's new goals for what they were; the first slipping of the fingers reaching towards supremacy.
So, over the last year or so, the new thing in feminist circles is to decry the atheist community as being anti-feminist, and you know what?..
The atheist community IS largely anti-feminist...because a disturbingly large and loud section of the modern (emphasis on this word) feminist movement is no longer talking about equal rights. Why would we want to enable inequality?
And, as we atheists are wont to do, our more aggressive and militant community-goers have become vocal about this and have become derisive of the modern feminist movement, because they are calling it for what it is...again, as militant atheists (such as yours truly) are wont to do.
But are we anti-egalitarian because of this? Are we against gender equality? Hell fucking no. I comfortably and safely think I speak for a very, very large part of the atheist population when I say we are pro-equality on a very large number of issues, and those regarding gender and race are some of the ones we are most active in.
So...I guess what I'm getting at here is...there's so many anti-feminist atheists because modern-day feminism is getting less and less about gender equality by the day and we're calling the bullshit for what it is.
Me, personally? You can call me an anti-feminist all you want, and you'd be right, I AM anti-feminist. I'm against one side getting an unfair or unreasonable advantage over the other. But if someone ever dares say I'm against gender equality, I'll knock their fucking teeth out...and I don't care if it's a guy or a girl who said it, either.
(See what I did there?)
"Social rights" and "social justice" are topics that are rapidly becoming nothing more than trendy little things for today's "social media-savvy" hipsters to cling to to make themselves appear "open-minded" and "enlightened" and "accepting" and "progressive," while in fact being absolutely none of those things at all. Just because you dress a doll up very nice and pretty and with care and interest doesn't make it a person, even if it looks closely like one. Just because you feel something is bad in society and take a stance about it doesn't mean that you're an equal-rights champion, even though it might seem related to the big-time conversation topics that are actually taking place in the circles of equal-rights activism.
So, why are there so many anti-feminists in the atheist community? Because the feminist community began overstepping its bounds as to what it was objecting to. It began making up bullshit, and rather than working to try to rub out the line between men and women, it started replacing it with another that it has begun to gouge into the ground, only this time placed closer to the male side of the discussion...and to clarify the analogy, modern feminism of today, in its more well-known and vocal form, has dropped its idea of equality, and has instead taken to the idea that women should not only be treated equally; they should be treated as superiors, and men as inferiors to them. Is it a blatant thing? Is it loudly pronounced, or even just merely stated directly? No.
Not yet anyway. But it's getting there. It doesn't take a telescope to see that shit on the horizon. It's already there, and it's pretty visible.
Basically, feminism peaked and was hitting a point where egalitarianism was on the table at last, and the dialogue seemed open and sincere; men were realizing where they were overstepping their bounds and looking down on women and socially, it was becoming the norm for men to begin working to correct that behavior.
Maybe the feminist community saw that as a weakness to be exploited, maybe they became impatient and started acting in ways that would allow them to push even harder to try to get results faster, I dunno. All I do know is the ideas of "rape culture," originally valid in their protests, started to become ridiculous, absurd, and strangely self-deprecating...only, not humorously. The claims that all men are potential rapists if they jerk off to porn sounded comical at first, sure. Until it became clear that the claims were actually genuine. After that point, it was all downhill.
Feminism has largely achieved what it set out to do. The current issues still plaguing our society are being steadily improved. "Real" feminists understand this. The ones who are getting louder rather than finding comfort at taking their place at their opposite gender's sides as equals are the ones who do not wish for equality; they want the scales to not balance, but simply to switch the discrepancies. Their goals are not egalitarian; they are, dare I use such a strong word, supremacist. Sure, sure, they're not at that point yet. But whether or not they realize it, that's where they're going. I could go into detailing why a lot of modern feminism's stances are so absurd and anti-egalitarian, but there's no need. You either recognize why, and therefore are egalitarian, or you think they are valid, and are probably aware of just what the goal actually is with pushing those points as valid stances, and will not be dissuaded any more than ISIS will be from not killing innocents and being murderous sub-primate beasts, no matter how much logic or reasoning is demonstrated against them.
Atheists, not to sound too much like a bragging blowhard tooting the non-believer-community's horn, tend to be very quick on the draw when it comes to spotting bullshit. Not ALWAYS. But let's not be too modest; it's true that, by and large, atheists ARE a little better than the rest at calling bullshit when they see it. And to be frank, feminism is starting to develop a lot of bullshit. Feminism found a staunch ally in the atheist community when feminism was bringing up genuine points about equality, but you need only look at the history of the tumbleweed-infested ghost town that is Atheism+ to understand why that is no longer the case. Ultrafeminists stopped addressing prejudice and inequality towards their gender, and started trying to get their erstwhile friends and allies in the atheist community to help them "get back at the man (literally)," to do more than merely level the playing field, and to instead dig out the ground from underneath those evil creatures with their pen0rz and pr0nz, and pack it under the virtuous and righteous feet of the mighty female warrior.
In other words, they figured that since atheists are one of the largest minorities, if not THE single largest minority (at least in the US; I think we are the single largest minority, actually), and we're also a minority that is actually discriminated against just as much, if not more so than the other minorities in question, that they would play up the whole "we're buddies in being discriminated against" thing to try to give themselves more "firepower" as it were. Atheists, after all, are well-known for being more and more militant and aggressive these days as we find ourselves less and less capable of tolerating bullshit being unfairly treated as acceptable and factual. They mistook atheist aggression as being something they could relate to.
Thing is, ultrafeminists more or less have what they want. Militant atheists are all the more militant for the frustration of being stuck exactly where we were when we started out. We're not gaining many concessions, and the ones that we DO win, we win only by holding up the constitution and pointing to the Establishment Clause. Socially-speaking, we're still where we were 20, 30 years ago. We're still hated, we're still looked upon as inferior, immoral, or what have you by the theistic population at large (the population that is the vast, overwhelming majority, it should be mentioned). We have much more in common with the LGBT community than we do the feminist community now. So those who have more than we do now, asking for our help to not only undo the discrimination remaining but to actually enact discrimination in their favor, to give them even MORE...well, surprise, surprise; it didn't go over very well. So then when the atheist community at large didn't fall for the "rape culture" BS as a motivator to enable discrimination in a mirror-opposite form, the modern feminist community began accusing the atheist community of being anti-feminist...thus showing the modern ultrafeminists' true colors. There was no gender-based discrimination coming from the atheist community. The atheist community just simply called feminism's new goals for what they were; the first slipping of the fingers reaching towards supremacy.
So, over the last year or so, the new thing in feminist circles is to decry the atheist community as being anti-feminist, and you know what?..
The atheist community IS largely anti-feminist...because a disturbingly large and loud section of the modern (emphasis on this word) feminist movement is no longer talking about equal rights. Why would we want to enable inequality?
And, as we atheists are wont to do, our more aggressive and militant community-goers have become vocal about this and have become derisive of the modern feminist movement, because they are calling it for what it is...again, as militant atheists (such as yours truly) are wont to do.
But are we anti-egalitarian because of this? Are we against gender equality? Hell fucking no. I comfortably and safely think I speak for a very, very large part of the atheist population when I say we are pro-equality on a very large number of issues, and those regarding gender and race are some of the ones we are most active in.
So...I guess what I'm getting at here is...there's so many anti-feminist atheists because modern-day feminism is getting less and less about gender equality by the day and we're calling the bullshit for what it is.
Me, personally? You can call me an anti-feminist all you want, and you'd be right, I AM anti-feminist. I'm against one side getting an unfair or unreasonable advantage over the other. But if someone ever dares say I'm against gender equality, I'll knock their fucking teeth out...and I don't care if it's a guy or a girl who said it, either.
(See what I did there?)
![[Image: dc52deee8e6b07186c04ff66a45fd204.jpg]](https://images.weserv.nl/?url=i585.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fss295%2Faaliyahqin%2Fcat%2Fdc52deee8e6b07186c04ff66a45fd204.jpg)
![[Image: 146748944129044_zpsomrzyn3d.gif]](https://images.weserv.nl/?url=i629.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fuu13%2FRXM843%2F146748944129044_zpsomrzyn3d.gif)
