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RE: Indiana's Govenor Signs 'Religious Freedom' Bill
April 12, 2015 at 11:38 am
(April 9, 2015 at 4:03 pm)Heywood Wrote: You simply want to force people to behave in a way that you want them to behave.
- Says the man who wants to force a woman who get pregnant to carry that fetus to term and give birth.
Quote:You need a very good reason, in my opinion, before you start curtailing individual freedom.
- Says the man who uses his personal feeling that "life begins at conception" even though he's been unable to logically argue why, at least not beyond his personal feelings. His personal feelings are good enough. And if enough people in the rest of society vote that way, it's perfectly OK as far as he's concerned for the government to intrude on the personal lives of women and tell them how to live it.
Because corporations are people and women are just baby-manufacturing machines.
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"The trinity can be equated to having your cake and eating it too."
... -Lucent, trying to defend the Trinity concept
"(Yahweh's) actions are good because (Yahweh) is the ultimate standard of goodness. That’s not begging the question"
... -Statler Waldorf, Christian apologist
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RE: Indiana's Govenor Signs 'Religious Freedom' Bill
April 12, 2015 at 1:28 pm
(April 10, 2015 at 11:16 am)Heywood Wrote: Gays have little difficulty finding other people willing to exchange goods and services with them.
Blacks could get goods too pre-60's. It was that the quality, price, and convenience of goods were not equal.
Remember, separate but equal is never equal.
The gays could get cakes and pediatric services from better hearted businessman, but they would have to expend needless effort to find replacement goods and services.
In your defense, Any mother that hires a christian that believes in WOO WOO magic over science, evidence, and evolution, isn't a very fit mother anyway, regardless if she prefers the P over the D.
Find the cure for Fundementia!
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RE: Indiana's Govenor Signs 'Religious Freedom' Bill
April 13, 2015 at 12:59 am
(This post was last modified: April 13, 2015 at 1:02 am by robvalue.)
I would love to hear from any theist what exactly is the problem with homosexuality.
Even if you insist that it's a choice, so what? What does it matter?
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RE: Indiana's Govenor Signs 'Religious Freedom' Bill
April 13, 2015 at 2:40 am
(This post was last modified: April 13, 2015 at 2:41 am by Heywood.)
(April 13, 2015 at 12:59 am)robvalue Wrote: I would love to hear from any theist what exactly is the problem with homosexuality.
Even if you insist that it's a choice, so what? What does it matter?
Homosexuality isn't equivalent to heterosexuality.....not the way races are equivalent. This is trivially easy to show by way of thought experiment. Suppose one day every human being on the planet woke up to discover that some unknown force made them all homosexuals. Such an event would be utterly devastating to humanity.
Now suppose one day every human being on the planet woke up to discover that some unknown force made them all heterosexual. Such an event would probably have no negative effect at all on humanity. If it did have some negative effect, it would be inconsequential. The same is true if everyone woke up to find they had been transformed into African Americans or Hispanics or Asians. Such transformations would have little impact on humanity.
If homosexuality and heterosexuality are not equivalent, then one is superior than the other. Theists have decided that heterosexuality is superior and thus they do not like the ideal of homosexuality being artificially elevated to the same stature.
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RE: Indiana's Govenor Signs 'Religious Freedom' Bill
April 13, 2015 at 2:49 am
(This post was last modified: April 13, 2015 at 2:52 am by robvalue.)
You think that is justification to treat homosexuals worse? Because in a fantasy scenario involving homosexuals something you don't like would happen? Why should we consider fantasy scenarios?
Also, you think God couldn't just make more people, or stop the above scenario?
I have never and will never have children. Should I be similarly discriminated against?
Why exactly do theists get to decide who is superior and who isn't? Life isn't a competition. No one is saying anything is "equivalent", that doesn't even mean anything. We're saying people should be treated equally and fairly.
Judge not lest ye be judged. I'm not saying I'm Jesus. That is for other people to say.
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RE: Indiana's Govenor Signs 'Religious Freedom' Bill
April 13, 2015 at 2:54 am
(This post was last modified: April 13, 2015 at 2:56 am by Heywood.)
(April 13, 2015 at 2:49 am)robvalue Wrote: You think that is justification to treat homosexuals worse? Because in a fantasy scenario involving them something you don't like would happen? Why should we consider fantasy scenarios?
I have never and will never have children. Should I be similarly discriminated against?
Why exactly do theists get to decide who is superior and who isn't? Life isn't a completion. No one is saying anything is "equivalent", that doesn't even mean anything. We're saying people should be treated equally and fairly.
For the sake of argument....accept for a moment that the premise "Heterosexuality is superior to Homosexuality" is true. Why then should we treat them as equivalents?
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RE: Indiana's Govenor Signs 'Religious Freedom' Bill
April 13, 2015 at 2:57 am
(This post was last modified: April 13, 2015 at 3:06 am by robvalue.)
What the fuck man?
That doesn't make any sense. No rational person claims either is superior, it's not a competition.
But if I "accept" that, then no, they should be treated the same. Why shouldn't they be? Should someone less intelligent than me be treated worse? Someone worse than me at basketball?
Someone should only be treated "worse" if they are hurting someone and need to be stopped.
"I won't server pizza to people worse at maths than me."
Does that sound like a reasonable statement?
I don't believe this is your real reason Heywood. I think these are rationalizations.
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RE: Indiana's Govenor Signs 'Religious Freedom' Bill
April 13, 2015 at 3:08 am
(April 13, 2015 at 2:57 am)robvalue Wrote: What the fuck man?
That doesn't make any sense. No rational person claims either is superior, it's not a competition.
But if I "accept" that, then no, they should be treated the same. Why shouldn't they be? Should someone less intelligent than me be treated worse? Someone worse than me at basketball?
You say "no rational person claims either is superior" but I provided you with a thought experiment which shows they are not equivalents. If they are not equivalents then one is superior than the other. Theists have a rational basis for their beliefs that heterosexuality is superior to homosexuality. Moving back toward the subject of this thread.....a theistic baker has a rational basis to differentiate a homosexual wedding from a straight wedding. If they have a rational basis to differentiate, doesn't that mean they have a rational reason to discriminate?
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RE: Indiana's Govenor Signs 'Religious Freedom' Bill
April 13, 2015 at 3:13 am
No. I can't believe what you are saying.
If you really mean that, if this is actually what you believe, then I'm appalled.
I'm done.
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RE: Indiana's Govenor Signs 'Religious Freedom' Bill
April 13, 2015 at 3:18 am
(This post was last modified: April 13, 2015 at 3:21 am by Heywood.)
(April 13, 2015 at 3:13 am)robvalue Wrote: No. I can't believe what you are saying.
If you really mean that, if this is actually what you believe, then I'm appalled.
I'm done.
I do not believe homosexuality and heterosexuality have equivalent value to humanity so I understand why some people are opposed to putting them on the same pedestal. I sorry that you are appalled. But you asked for a theistic perspective.....so I gave you one. Maybe you were expecting something based in religious dogma or scripture.....sorry to let you down.
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