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What the hell is a 'soul' anyway?
#45
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway?
(August 29, 2015 at 2:22 am)Ronkonkoma Wrote: The term soul was first introduced by the Greek philosophers. Its the immaterial part of you, a part of the immaterial world.

The Greek philosophers realized that Mathematics is also a part of the immaterial world.

The soul, like math, has no weight or mass, you can't see it and it doesn't alter light.

Like math, you can study its effects because the soul gives human life its fundamental essence and value.

This concept became more refined after Christian teaching met the philosophies of Plato, Aristoteles, and Socrates.

The human soul houses the core of human desire, and as such is an important basis of our understanding of personhood.

The Greeks also believed that the earth was the center of the universe. tits Evidence or GTFO.

(August 29, 2015 at 2:22 am)Ronkonkoma Wrote: This has implications on human dignity, human rights, responsibilities, and freedom. If you ignore these things, you see important implications, the culmination of which are the Gulags of the Soviet Union for instance, or the Holocaust, or the carpet bombing of Dresden and perhaps the destruction of Hiroshima.  

I see your point, but it still doesn't prove that the soul is an independent entity. To me, human lives have an intrinsic value too, but that's because I enjoy my life and I have good reasons to assume that other people want to enjoy their lives as well. No souls required.

(August 29, 2015 at 2:22 am)Ronkonkoma Wrote: All these things (dignity, rights, responsibilities, freedom), like the soul, are immaterial.

Value, like the soul, is also immaterial.

Value can generate bills of money from seemingly "nothing". In material terms, a stack of bills is nothing but paper. But money can be put to use to alter material things, such as the great cathedrals and churches of Europe, which are direct expressions on the effect of the soul on matter.

I think this is because we are organisms that have evolved to understand the world around them. The world is really, really complicated and therefore, abstract thought is a great tool to recognize the patterns that occur naturally in our experience of the world. We have an experience and we associate it to the previous experiences we've had, and we "create" the idea by keeping together the things all these experiences had in common.

(August 29, 2015 at 2:22 am)Ronkonkoma Wrote: Similarly, persons in material terms are seemingly nothing but DNA, or ribonucleic acids, but they can generate ideas, hopes and dreams, and put values into reality. Say for example, I value my kids, I can alter reality by reading to them at night. I made that value a reality in the irreversible past. DNA can't do that. On the other hand, our material brain is the most complex thing we know of in the entire universe. In material terms there is no way that we have any idea what a thought, or a value, or a soul is.

Good night, kids.

And this is where I get mad. Because you are completely misunderstanding and underestimating the whole of molecular biology.

1. DNA is deoxyribonucleic acid, not "ribonucleic acids".

2. People are NOT "just DNA". DNA holds the "plans" that guide the development of the structures that make out our body and the synthesis of the proteins that are needed for our organism's life. Those structures, on the other hand, are way more complex than DNA is and have different functions. Our material brain is a product of the unfolding of the reactions that many particular sequences of DNA can help catalysing by codifying for enzymes. Enzymes are, in turn, those things that actually go and catalyse the reactions that are needed to happen for our organism's development and survival.

I could go about for days here talking about gene regulation and the like, but I've got other stuff to do so if you want to go deeper in this subject, this is probably the best starting point:

http://www.amazon.com/Molecular-Biology-...0321905377

Yeah, it's not cheap, but you can definitely Google around and find some cheap second-hand copies of it somewhere.
"Every luxury has a deep price. Every indulgence, a cosmic cost. Each fiber of pleasure you experience causes equivalent pain somewhere else. This is the first law of emodynamics [sic]. Joy can be neither created nor destroyed. The balance of happiness is constant.

Fact: Every time you eat a bite of cake, someone gets horsewhipped.

Facter: Every time two people kiss, an orphanage collapses.

Factest: Every time a baby is born, an innocent animal is severely mocked for its physical appearance. Don't be a pleasure hog. Your every smile is a dagger. Happiness is murder.

Vote "yes" on Proposition 1321. Think of some kids. Some kids."
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Messages In This Thread
What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Lucanus - August 27, 2015 at 7:01 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Ashground - August 27, 2015 at 7:04 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by robvalue - August 27, 2015 at 7:09 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Lucanus - August 27, 2015 at 7:14 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by IATIA - August 30, 2015 at 11:04 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by robvalue - August 30, 2015 at 1:14 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by abaris - August 27, 2015 at 7:14 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Longhorn - August 27, 2015 at 7:20 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Lucanus - August 27, 2015 at 7:22 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by ignoramus - August 27, 2015 at 7:26 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Kingpin - August 27, 2015 at 8:48 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Lucanus - August 27, 2015 at 9:27 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Jenny A - August 27, 2015 at 5:49 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Ravenshire - August 27, 2015 at 9:51 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by brewer - August 27, 2015 at 8:55 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by vorlon13 - August 27, 2015 at 10:54 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Spooky - August 27, 2015 at 3:30 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Wyrd of Gawd - August 27, 2015 at 5:17 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Ravenshire - August 27, 2015 at 9:56 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Neo-Scholastic - August 27, 2015 at 7:44 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Paraselene - August 27, 2015 at 7:45 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Neo-Scholastic - August 27, 2015 at 7:47 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Paraselene - August 27, 2015 at 7:48 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Jenny A - August 27, 2015 at 10:06 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Lucanus - August 28, 2015 at 2:29 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by downbeatplumb - August 29, 2015 at 3:58 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Cyberman - August 29, 2015 at 6:43 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Brakeman - August 29, 2015 at 9:18 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Pyrrho - August 27, 2015 at 9:21 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Redbeard The Pink - August 27, 2015 at 11:07 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by MTL - August 27, 2015 at 11:57 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by robvalue - August 28, 2015 at 1:31 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by ignoramus - August 28, 2015 at 3:48 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Neo-Scholastic - August 28, 2015 at 12:53 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Lucanus - August 28, 2015 at 1:33 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by FifthElement - August 29, 2015 at 1:15 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by robvalue - August 28, 2015 at 1:52 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Whateverist - August 28, 2015 at 2:09 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by tonechaser77 - August 28, 2015 at 4:34 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by MysticKnight - August 29, 2015 at 12:22 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Lucanus - August 29, 2015 at 4:19 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by robvalue - August 29, 2015 at 1:30 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Ronkonkoma - August 29, 2015 at 2:22 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Lucanus - August 29, 2015 at 4:50 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Ronkonkoma - August 29, 2015 at 11:19 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Lucanus - August 30, 2015 at 4:52 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Ronkonkoma - August 30, 2015 at 7:05 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Cyberman - August 30, 2015 at 7:08 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Ronkonkoma - August 30, 2015 at 7:31 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Ravenshire - August 30, 2015 at 8:45 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Esquilax - August 30, 2015 at 7:29 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Whateverist - August 29, 2015 at 12:36 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Ronkonkoma - August 30, 2015 at 5:04 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Whateverist - August 30, 2015 at 10:28 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Ronkonkoma - August 30, 2015 at 10:54 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Ravenshire - August 30, 2015 at 3:29 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by robvalue - August 29, 2015 at 3:03 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by robvalue - August 29, 2015 at 4:48 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by robvalue - August 29, 2015 at 4:51 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Lucanus - August 29, 2015 at 4:53 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by robvalue - August 29, 2015 at 4:55 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Longhorn - August 29, 2015 at 8:05 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Cyberman - August 29, 2015 at 6:41 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by ignoramus - August 29, 2015 at 8:02 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by robvalue - August 29, 2015 at 8:10 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Whateverist - August 30, 2015 at 10:57 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Ronkonkoma - August 30, 2015 at 7:12 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Ravenshire - August 30, 2015 at 8:44 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Whateverist - August 31, 2015 at 12:19 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Ronkonkoma - September 1, 2015 at 2:15 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Lucanus - September 1, 2015 at 2:22 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Ronkonkoma - September 1, 2015 at 2:30 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Esquilax - September 1, 2015 at 6:31 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by IATIA - September 3, 2015 at 5:55 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Drich - August 30, 2015 at 11:06 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by IATIA - August 30, 2015 at 11:18 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Drich - August 30, 2015 at 1:26 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by IATIA - August 30, 2015 at 1:43 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Esquilax - August 30, 2015 at 3:38 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Cyberman - August 30, 2015 at 7:44 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by thehedglin - August 30, 2015 at 7:52 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by IATIA - August 30, 2015 at 11:41 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by ignoramus - August 31, 2015 at 6:30 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by downbeatplumb - August 31, 2015 at 7:08 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Mudhammam - August 31, 2015 at 6:22 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Lucanus - August 31, 2015 at 8:37 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Mudhammam - August 31, 2015 at 9:03 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Paraselene - August 31, 2015 at 6:32 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by comet - August 31, 2015 at 7:30 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Lucanus - September 1, 2015 at 4:00 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by vorlon13 - September 1, 2015 at 7:46 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by IATIA - September 2, 2015 at 12:07 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by vorlon13 - September 1, 2015 at 7:47 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by vorlon13 - September 2, 2015 at 12:10 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by IATIA - September 2, 2015 at 12:12 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Cecelia - September 2, 2015 at 9:21 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Whateverist - September 2, 2015 at 11:03 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Cecelia - September 2, 2015 at 11:18 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by robvalue - September 3, 2015 at 2:04 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Pyrrho - September 3, 2015 at 11:28 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by thehedglin - September 3, 2015 at 11:33 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Ravenshire - September 6, 2015 at 7:00 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Pyrrho - September 3, 2015 at 11:51 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by thehedglin - September 3, 2015 at 3:44 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by robvalue - September 3, 2015 at 12:29 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Whateverist - September 4, 2015 at 1:12 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Ronkonkoma - September 7, 2015 at 4:28 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by robvalue - September 4, 2015 at 1:45 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by TubbyTubby - September 4, 2015 at 3:25 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by robvalue - September 4, 2015 at 3:32 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by TubbyTubby - September 4, 2015 at 4:43 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Jackie - September 4, 2015 at 9:41 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Cyberman - September 4, 2015 at 10:05 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Lucanus - September 4, 2015 at 10:17 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Cyberman - September 4, 2015 at 3:45 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Little lunch - September 4, 2015 at 8:33 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by IATIA - September 4, 2015 at 10:38 pm
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Little lunch - September 5, 2015 at 2:38 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Cyberman - September 5, 2015 at 6:17 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by ignoramus - September 5, 2015 at 7:34 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by robvalue - September 5, 2015 at 10:35 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Cyberman - September 5, 2015 at 11:32 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by robvalue - September 5, 2015 at 11:41 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by ignoramus - September 6, 2015 at 7:19 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by robvalue - September 6, 2015 at 9:02 am
RE: What the hell is a 'soul' anyway? - by Little lunch - September 6, 2015 at 6:12 pm

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