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Why atheism?
#48
RE: Why atheism?
@ the OP

On the contrary belief cannot be chosen at all ever, nor can disbelief. You are either convinced or not. You can't stare at the sun and know it is the sun and choose to believe it isn't. It's simply not possible.

Belief and disbelief aren't voluntary actions. The most control you can have over them is through selective confirmation bias and that's not even a good kind of freedom. That's an irrational kind.

I don't believe in free will or IOW free choices. Not ultimately free choices that are separate from all external factors. I do however believe in choices and I do distinguish between intentional "voluntary" decisions and unintentional involuntary reflexes, etc. I am not a fatalist, our choices and decisions actually matter - there are many things we wouldn't do if we didn't intend and decide to do them. This post wouldn't have written itself if I had not chosen to write it - but I do believe it wasn't a free choice ultimately because it was either predetermined ultimately or it is undetermined and I don't have control over indeterminacy factors for the same reason I don't decide what the roll of the dice lands on.

Now belief/disbelief aren't even "voluntary"/intentional decisions. They aren't even really actions they are mental representations of our own view of the world and what we consider to be true, false and uncertain. Once again, you're either convinced or you're not.

Despite that they are not actions though, actions certainly are generally more revealing of what one truly believes than what one merely claims to believe - but that's a separate matter and let us not confuse the two.

So why atheism? Not convinced, simple as.
Reply



Messages In This Thread
Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 8:20 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by houseofcantor - October 13, 2015 at 8:23 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Mermaid - October 14, 2015 at 7:43 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Chad32 - October 13, 2015 at 8:28 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Esquilax - October 13, 2015 at 8:30 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by jenny1972 - October 13, 2015 at 8:36 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Angrboda - October 13, 2015 at 8:36 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by vorlon13 - October 13, 2015 at 8:38 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Chad32 - October 13, 2015 at 8:42 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Minimalist - October 13, 2015 at 8:41 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 8:45 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by vorlon13 - October 13, 2015 at 10:06 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Mister Agenda - October 14, 2015 at 11:26 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Exian - October 13, 2015 at 8:45 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 8:47 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Esquilax - October 13, 2015 at 8:49 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Chad32 - October 13, 2015 at 8:49 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by vorlon13 - October 13, 2015 at 10:06 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Nay_Sayer - October 13, 2015 at 10:09 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 8:49 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 8:50 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Minimalist - October 13, 2015 at 8:52 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Angrboda - October 13, 2015 at 8:55 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 8:56 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Angrboda - October 13, 2015 at 8:58 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Losty - October 13, 2015 at 9:04 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by jenny1972 - October 13, 2015 at 9:45 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Nay_Sayer - October 13, 2015 at 9:47 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Minimalist - October 13, 2015 at 8:56 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JesusHChrist - October 13, 2015 at 9:00 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Mister Agenda - October 14, 2015 at 11:29 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Chad32 - October 13, 2015 at 9:00 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Losty - October 13, 2015 at 9:03 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 9:04 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by vorlon13 - October 13, 2015 at 10:08 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 9:05 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Losty - October 13, 2015 at 9:08 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 9:18 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Losty - October 13, 2015 at 9:19 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 9:22 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Simon Moon - October 13, 2015 at 9:26 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Losty - October 13, 2015 at 9:27 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by jenny1972 - October 13, 2015 at 10:12 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Mister Agenda - October 14, 2015 at 11:35 am
RE: Why atheism? - by JackRussell - October 14, 2015 at 11:39 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Darkstar - October 13, 2015 at 9:18 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by downbeatplumb - October 14, 2015 at 9:53 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Lemonvariable72 - October 13, 2015 at 10:36 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Mister Agenda - October 14, 2015 at 11:30 am
RE: Why atheism? - by The Valkyrie - October 13, 2015 at 9:06 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 9:16 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Losty - October 13, 2015 at 9:18 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 9:20 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Losty - October 13, 2015 at 9:24 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by The Valkyrie - October 13, 2015 at 9:27 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 9:39 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Losty - October 13, 2015 at 9:41 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by The Valkyrie - October 13, 2015 at 9:48 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 9:55 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Losty - October 13, 2015 at 9:57 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by The Valkyrie - October 13, 2015 at 10:02 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Nay_Sayer - October 13, 2015 at 10:05 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 10:08 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by The Valkyrie - October 13, 2015 at 10:19 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Homeless Nutter - October 13, 2015 at 10:23 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Mister Agenda - October 14, 2015 at 11:47 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Simon Moon - October 13, 2015 at 9:37 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 9:42 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Homeless Nutter - October 13, 2015 at 9:43 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 9:49 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Homeless Nutter - October 13, 2015 at 9:55 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 9:57 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Homeless Nutter - October 13, 2015 at 10:05 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 10:11 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Losty - October 13, 2015 at 10:17 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Homeless Nutter - October 13, 2015 at 10:17 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Losty - October 13, 2015 at 9:55 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Losty - October 13, 2015 at 9:46 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Darkstar - October 13, 2015 at 9:47 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 9:50 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by The Valkyrie - October 13, 2015 at 9:52 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Hmmm? - October 13, 2015 at 9:58 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Darkstar - October 13, 2015 at 10:09 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Losty - October 14, 2015 at 2:52 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Simon Moon - October 13, 2015 at 9:49 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Simon Moon - October 13, 2015 at 9:54 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by rexbeccarox - October 13, 2015 at 10:54 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Mister Agenda - October 14, 2015 at 11:58 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Mister Agenda - October 14, 2015 at 11:34 am
RE: Why atheism? - by jenny1972 - October 14, 2015 at 2:32 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Losty - October 14, 2015 at 2:33 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by jenny1972 - October 14, 2015 at 2:44 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JesusHChrist - October 14, 2015 at 2:48 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Iroscato - October 14, 2015 at 3:01 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by The Valkyrie - October 13, 2015 at 9:22 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Simon Moon - October 13, 2015 at 9:21 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 9:24 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Losty - October 13, 2015 at 9:28 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Mister Agenda - October 14, 2015 at 11:37 am
RE: Why atheism? - by brewer - October 13, 2015 at 9:33 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Losty - October 13, 2015 at 9:38 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Edwardo Piet - October 13, 2015 at 9:38 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Thumpalumpacus - October 13, 2015 at 9:39 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Homeless Nutter - October 13, 2015 at 9:40 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Nay_Sayer - October 13, 2015 at 9:46 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Hmmm? - October 13, 2015 at 9:49 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 10:04 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Thumpalumpacus - October 13, 2015 at 10:11 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 10:12 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Nay_Sayer - October 13, 2015 at 10:17 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Thumpalumpacus - October 13, 2015 at 11:29 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Darkstar - October 13, 2015 at 10:16 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 10:23 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Darkstar - October 13, 2015 at 10:27 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Hmmm? - October 13, 2015 at 10:30 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 10:29 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Darkstar - October 13, 2015 at 10:31 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Thumpalumpacus - October 13, 2015 at 11:33 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Neo-Scholastic - October 13, 2015 at 10:32 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Silver - October 13, 2015 at 10:36 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Homeless Nutter - October 13, 2015 at 10:43 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by The Valkyrie - October 13, 2015 at 10:43 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Ravenshire - October 13, 2015 at 10:45 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Simon Moon - October 13, 2015 at 10:46 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Minimalist - October 13, 2015 at 11:39 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Losty - October 14, 2015 at 2:40 am
RE: Why atheism? - by houseofcantor - October 14, 2015 at 11:13 am
RE: Why atheism? - by abaris - October 14, 2015 at 11:19 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Neo-Scholastic - October 14, 2015 at 3:55 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Faith No More - October 13, 2015 at 10:36 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 10:36 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Faith No More - October 13, 2015 at 10:38 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Losty - October 14, 2015 at 2:42 am
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 13, 2015 at 10:43 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Silver - October 13, 2015 at 10:47 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Ravenshire - October 13, 2015 at 10:44 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Faith No More - October 13, 2015 at 10:49 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by The Valkyrie - October 13, 2015 at 10:51 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Jackalope - October 13, 2015 at 10:53 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Simon Moon - October 13, 2015 at 10:53 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by KevinM1 - October 13, 2015 at 11:09 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by The Valkyrie - October 13, 2015 at 11:16 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Silver - October 13, 2015 at 11:34 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Thumpalumpacus - October 14, 2015 at 1:37 am
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 14, 2015 at 8:34 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Homeless Nutter - October 14, 2015 at 8:42 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Iroscato - October 14, 2015 at 8:45 am
RE: Why atheism? - by JBrentonK - October 14, 2015 at 8:48 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Iroscato - October 14, 2015 at 8:56 am
RE: Why atheism? - by SofaKingHigh - October 14, 2015 at 9:45 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Losty - October 14, 2015 at 9:43 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Iroscato - October 14, 2015 at 10:05 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Losty - October 14, 2015 at 9:41 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Faith No More - October 14, 2015 at 9:45 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Losty - October 14, 2015 at 9:48 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Faith No More - October 14, 2015 at 9:57 am
RE: Why atheism? - by TheRocketSurgeon - October 14, 2015 at 10:09 am
RE: Why atheism? - by SofaKingHigh - October 14, 2015 at 10:09 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Thumpalumpacus - October 14, 2015 at 10:18 am
RE: Why atheism? - by robvalue - October 14, 2015 at 12:52 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Cato - October 14, 2015 at 12:57 am
RE: Why atheism? - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - October 14, 2015 at 2:35 am
RE: Why atheism? - by ignoramus - October 14, 2015 at 4:18 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Fidel_Castronaut - October 14, 2015 at 4:28 am
RE: Why atheism? - by brewer - October 14, 2015 at 8:41 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Thumpalumpacus - October 14, 2015 at 10:37 am
RE: Why atheism? - by JesusHChrist - October 14, 2015 at 10:40 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Faith No More - October 14, 2015 at 10:18 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Athene - October 14, 2015 at 11:13 am
RE: Why atheism? - by SofaKingHigh - October 14, 2015 at 11:15 am
RE: Why atheism? - by houseofcantor - October 14, 2015 at 11:21 am
RE: Why atheism? - by SofaKingHigh - October 14, 2015 at 11:55 am
RE: Why atheism? - by Mister Agenda - October 14, 2015 at 11:21 am
RE: Why atheism? - by JesusHChrist - October 14, 2015 at 11:29 am
RE: Why atheism? - by KevinM1 - October 14, 2015 at 12:13 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Mister Agenda - October 14, 2015 at 12:21 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Edwardo Piet - October 14, 2015 at 2:35 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by jenny1972 - October 14, 2015 at 2:53 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JesusHChrist - October 14, 2015 at 3:05 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by jenny1972 - October 14, 2015 at 3:15 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by JesusHChrist - October 14, 2015 at 3:45 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by The Valkyrie - October 14, 2015 at 2:42 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by TheRocketSurgeon - October 14, 2015 at 2:50 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by The Valkyrie - October 14, 2015 at 2:53 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by jenny1972 - October 14, 2015 at 3:09 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by The Valkyrie - October 14, 2015 at 3:14 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by TheRocketSurgeon - October 14, 2015 at 3:15 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by jenny1972 - October 14, 2015 at 3:26 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by TheRocketSurgeon - October 14, 2015 at 3:33 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Simon Moon - October 14, 2015 at 3:35 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Thumpalumpacus - October 14, 2015 at 2:51 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by MentalGiant - October 14, 2015 at 3:13 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by jenny1972 - October 14, 2015 at 3:17 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by TheRocketSurgeon - October 14, 2015 at 3:23 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by jenny1972 - October 14, 2015 at 3:48 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Simon Moon - October 14, 2015 at 4:00 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by MentalGiant - October 14, 2015 at 3:26 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by jenny1972 - October 14, 2015 at 4:06 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by The Valkyrie - October 14, 2015 at 4:13 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by LastPoet - October 14, 2015 at 3:28 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by The Valkyrie - October 14, 2015 at 3:32 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by TheRocketSurgeon - October 14, 2015 at 3:57 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Neo-Scholastic - October 14, 2015 at 3:58 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by TheRocketSurgeon - October 14, 2015 at 7:24 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by The Valkyrie - October 14, 2015 at 7:25 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by TheRocketSurgeon - October 14, 2015 at 7:30 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by jenny1972 - October 14, 2015 at 4:20 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Losty - October 14, 2015 at 7:03 pm
RE: Why atheism? - by Edwardo Piet - October 14, 2015 at 4:07 pm

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