(November 2, 2015 at 11:14 pm)Nestor Wrote: Yeah, the Neoplatonist Plotinus advocated evil as the privation of good. Augustine and later Christan philosophers adopted it like so much else from the Platonists. It asserts that evil is non-being, or the lack of existence, as all existence is essentially good as it subsists in deity. Interestingly, it renders God responsible for evil in that a perfectly good being must either create that which is perfectly good, or that which lacks His perfect goodness, and that is, according to the Neoplatonists/Christians, evil.
Quote:Yes, God saw that it was good in Genesis 1. The current state does not need to reflect the original. I am open to evil having being, if you wish to make that argument. However, I think you will find that many here believe that neither good nor evil have any absolute reality in regards to being. They say that good and evil are subjective, and can change based on the subject. If that is the case, then we may not be even speaking of the same things.
[quote='Nestor' pid='1104508' dateline='1446520480']
Your appeal to free will fails for the reasons I already submitted, putting aside the fact that free will is a poorly defined concept that has no relevancy here once remodified; there's the further problem that your God, if he is perfect, lacks free will (as a result of his other attributes, namely, omnibenevolence and omniscience), so there's no reason why we should possess it for any greater good - as it's apparently not necessary for the greatest good, God.
By free will I mean a conscience and responsible choice. Again, I think you loose any strength in your argument, if you take away accountability and choice. Are you saying that free will is contrary to goodness?
[quote='Nestor' pid='1104508' dateline='1446520480']
If we are able to do evil, we are, contrary to what a perfect God would seemingly be able to effect, created imperfect. Your appeal to what may be called the "Mysterious Ways Principle" is shoddy reasoning that relies on the same inferences a young-young-young-YOUNG earthist might use to justify his belief that the world is less than a 100 years old. Namely, he might say things appear older for a reason only God understands. It's a misapplication of inductive argumentation and demonstrates the weakness of your claim in that it calls for a blind leap of faith rather than the simpler explanation which only relies on the data that we currently possess: apparent unnecessary and excessive suffering exists all around us; therefore, a non-apparent omnipotent and omnibenevolent deity does not.
I'm simply saying that I cannot explain everything, but I don't think that you have made a positive case that it is unnecessary or without reason either. From reading the scripture, and personal experience of God, I do believe God that He is Good. From history and evidence in nature, I do believe the God of the Bible exists. And I concede that sin and evil are present in the world. I don't accept your premise, that evil or suffering cannot be present if God is good, so it is up to you to support it. How do you explain evil from an atheistic worldview? Is there real good and evil; or is it something you entertain when you want to make an argument against God?
