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Young Earth Creationism Vs. Science (Statler Waldorf Contd)
RE: Young Earth Creationism Vs. Science (Statler Waldorf Contd)
(March 1, 2011 at 8:06 pm)Statler Waldorf Wrote: Well I have not had a chance to read all of your last response yet :-( This is an interesting idea, but what I think you will find is it is impossible to synchronize the clocks necessary to conduct the experiment without using a synchrony convention. You could use the Einstein convention to do this but this would be begging the question because it assumes light moves at the same speeds in all directions relative to the observer (hence why radio waves from the voyager does not measure the speed of light in one direction because the ESC is used to synchronize the two clocks involved). You could also use the ASC to synchronize the clocks, but this would also be begging the question because it assumes light moves at different speeds in different directions relative to the observer. This is why these are conventions
Choosing a convention is completely unnecessary, but re-reading the Foucault Method, which to my embarassment I apparently didn't read thoroughly enough or mistaked another experiment for this one because I must have somehow erroneously thought that the method involved an average between two distances.
... but I was wrong, but interestingly, in doing so I've proven how little you know about the measurement of the speed of light and how absolutely wrong ASC is about the speed of light.
I had it in my head at some point that the Foucault Method involved an average, but I was wrong. In fact, most methods of measuring the speed of light doesn't average between two distances - it only measures for one distance.

The Foucault method uses the deflection angle of the beam of light and measures the distance exactly once because it measures the displacement of light upon a particular lens that acts as a beam splitter.

I had also mentioned a number of other methods that involve the use of chocolate or marshmellows and a microwave.

(March 1, 2011 at 8:06 pm)Statler Waldorf Wrote: What are you even talking about? That's been the whole point of this discussion from the get-go. There is no test that can demonstrate light moves at different speeds or the same speed for that matter relative to the observer. All of these tests require a synchrony convention in order to synchronize the clocks. If I use the Einstein Synchrony Convention it will show that light moves the same speed in all directions relative to an observer and that time-dilation due to motion is negligible at speeds not approaching 14 percent of the speed of light, but that's because this convention assumes all of this to be true! If I used the ASC to synchronize the clocks it would show that light moves at different directions relative to the observer and that time-dilation is not negligible even at speeds only 1 percent of the speed of light. That's why these are called conventions. They are different ways of measuring the same observed phenomenon, and to say that one is somehow more “correct” than the other demonstrates a fundamental misunderstanding of the issue.

This wasn't addressed to me, but I need to answer this as well.
No modern test I've looked up requires the average between two distances.
We have cooborating evidence from our robotic and human explorations throughout the solar system both with and without clocks of any kind and none of these methods require clocks to be sychronized. The foucault method was invented and used to come very close to the modern measurement of the speed of light well before Einstein was even born, let alone had a 'method' named after him.

Not to mention to the fact that all of the sciecne today that uses relativity and depends on relativity assume the speed of light is constant, which has been able to produce predicable results as per what allows all science to qualify as science. The atomic bomb (much to Einstein's dismay) was invented based on that principle of light and matter being two states of the same thing, which itself is built upon the assumption that the speed of light is constant and the same to all observers.
ASC contradicts more than a hundred years of physics, which was founded to be true based on repeated experiment and confirmed predictions based on those hypothosis.
If today you can take a thing like evolution and make it a crime to teach in the public schools, tomorrow you can make it a crime to teach it in the private schools and next year you can make it a crime to teach it to the hustings or in the church. At the next session you may ban books and the newspapers...
Ignorance and fanaticism are ever busy and need feeding. Always feeding and gloating for more. Today it is the public school teachers; tomorrow the private. The next day the preachers and the lecturers, the magazines, the books, the newspapers. After a while, Your Honor, it is the setting of man against man and creed against creed until with flying banners and beating drums we are marching backward to the glorious ages of the sixteenth centry when bigots lighted fagots to burn the men who dared to bring any intelligence and enlightenment and culture to the human mind. ~Clarence Darrow, at the Scopes Monkey Trial, 1925

Politics is supposed to be the second-oldest profession. I have come to realize that it bears a very close resemblance to the first. ~Ronald Reagan
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Messages In This Thread
RE: Young Earth Creationism Vs. Science (Statler Waldorf Contd) - by TheDarkestOfAngels - March 3, 2011 at 2:43 am

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