Making the case for Islam.

[Brian37]

At the end of the day, we cannot even value an act without belief in that there is some value to the person we are praising for that action and state of being.   But as discussed before in other threads, we cannot decide what a value of ourselves or others are. It's like looking at the moon, I can estimate it's size, but at the end, that doesn't make it's size. I can not estimate it's size but believe it's something, but that won't define it either. Yet when it comes to value of the humans, it's not such that it simply exists in space or 3d, it's a something that is experienced with perception.

We require an objective perception to who we are to have objective value. But we aren't that impartial judge nor have that perception. At the same time, if we make it the case that we don't have value, we simply believe we do, or we make one according to our standards, then it's really a delusion. It has no basis, we believe there is an objective value to people even if we don't know there is.

My problem with discussions is people usually don't look at the whole argument or the central argument, but look at the phrases leading up to it, and respond to that. 
I think I have a lot patience in that I repeat the same things over and over again, in different ways, but people still don't address the crux of the argument.
 
Ok you believe morals is what humans think and have nothing to do with God because you have no evidence for God. What does this have to do with the argument I showed?

No Mystic, the problem is not us, the problem is you. The problem is your failure to see the reality that you are not being objective, you are merely arguing from appeal to emotion and appeal to tradition. This is what all religions do, not just you and not just with the Quran. Christians and Jews and Hindus and Buddhists also argue their writings explain everything. You are merely stuck on a story you bought because it appeals to you. You want to believe what you argue is unique and the truth, but it isn't. 

You can go on Youtube and literally find countless videos of other mammals such as dogs and cats and chimps and elephants and dolphins showing empathy for family and even other species. Our species behaviors, both good and bad are in our evolution, not any old religion or book of myth. It was understandable in antiquity that humans made bad guesses and ended up with Hinduism and Buddhism and Christianity and Jewish and Islam, just like the Egyptian polytheistic gods were never real, nor were the Greek and Roman polytheistic gods.

You don't need religion or a god belief to do good or be good. There is no cosmic sky hero helping us. Humans are all we have.