(September 29, 2016 at 9:45 pm)Aractus Wrote:Firefighter01(September 29, 2016 at 8:13 am)Firefighter01 Wrote: How can a divine spook be historical? I think that you misunderstand my take on Jesus. I've got no problem believing that a wandering kook named Jesus existed at that time, there were probably a few of them. I don't believe in the magical Jesus of the Bible. If you take away all the stories of the miracles, there's fuck all left. Why would anyone follow around a Neville Nobody that didn't do anything special, let alone record what happened to him that wasn't miraculous? If he didn't draw huge crowds and muttered to himself and a few followers, why would the Romans even bother stringing him up?
I have already specifically addressed this point. Most of the activities that Jesus engages in are in delivering teachings/sermons/parables, and giving faith-healings and exorcisms. He instigated the last supper as well - something Paul knows about and quotes in 1 Corinthians 11. He delivered the sermon on the mount, the parable of the good Samaritan, the parable of the prodigal son, he shows genuine compassion to those in need, he told people don't judge others lest you be judged and to love thy enemy as thyself. He argued with the Pharisees, the Scribes, other Temple Authorities, and even wealthy Jews as well. He preached a message of repentance, of obedience to the law, and of the coming kingdom of God. There's nothing miraculous or supernatural about that, I've already pointed that out to you - so your premise is completely wrong. There is plenty left without any miracles.
Faith healings and exorsisms would not not get him converts if they didn't work. If they did work, they would be called miracles. The last supper, the Lord's supper or sacred meal was well known and copied from Greek and Egyptian religions including Mithraism. Paul, if he existed may have got the idea when he was in Tarsus. New Testament scholar Dr. Jonathan A. Draper wrote:
Quote:"The first mention we have of the Mithraic cult in the Roman Orient is in Tarsus (Cilicia), the home of a number of Stoic philosophers and of the worshiping of Herakles Sandan, the bull-killer, and also the place where Saul of Tarsus started his strange path. (Draper, Orality, Literacy and Colonialism in Antiquity, Brill, 2004, p. 104)"The Sermon on The Mount was way too complex and lengthy to be recited to a crowd of multitudes, let alone recorded by anyone, was composed originally in Greek and speaks of the death of the temple cult. So Jesus could not have given it and most NT scholars agree on this. To love thy enemy as thyself and to turn the other cheek is just stupid advice and wasn't shown to the Canaanites by God.
As for his compassion to those in need;
The Cost of Following Jesus
57As they were walking along the road, a man said to him, “I will follow you wherever you go.”
58Jesus replied, “Foxes have dens and birds have nests, but the Son of Man has no place to lay his head.”
59He said to another man, “Follow me.”
But he replied, “Lord, first let me go and bury my father.”
60Jesus said to him, “Let the dead bury their own dead, but you go and proclaim the kingdom of God.”
61Still another said, “I will follow you, Lord; but first let me go back and say goodbye to my family.”
62Jesus replied, “No one who puts a hand to the plow and looks back is fit for service in the kingdom of God.”
