(February 14, 2017 at 3:15 pm)Aroura Wrote:
(February 14, 2017 at 2:19 pm)SteveII Wrote: You say there is no evidence for Free Will. Isn't your conclusion that there is no Free Will based on naturalism--a philosophical position, and not based on science or other concrete 'evidence'? Why should I believe your ideology that there is nothing but natural properties and causes when I have very good reason to suspect there is more than that? In case you are going to ask what are my reasons, I would reply that Naturalism does not address why:a. no it isn't, it's overly complicated and only raises more difficult questions.
a. God is the best explanation why anything at all exists.
b. God is the best explanation of the origin of the universe.
c. God is the best explanation of the fine-tuning of the universe for intelligent life.
d. God is the best explanation of intentional states of consciousness.
e. God is the best explanation of objective moral values and duties.
b. no it isn't, it's overly complicated and only raises more difficult questions.
c. no it isn't, it's overly complicated and only raises more difficult questions.
d. no it isn't, it's overly complicated and only raises more difficult questions.
e. no it isn't, it's overly complicated and only raises more difficult questions.
Determinism is not a philosophical position any more than atheism is. I just don't believe in it, as there is no scientific evidence it exists. I'm an a-free-will-ist.
You assert it exists, much like God, so it's on you to show me evidence that it does. You also assert there is something aside from the natural, so that's on you too.
Show me evidence of a choice made that was not affected by prior causes, ever, in all of human history. Go ahead, I'll just wait right here........
Determinism is a doctrine that stems from a metaphysical naturalism worldview--there only exists material properties and causes. This is most definitely a philosophical position.
Your question: "Show me evidence of a choice made that was not affected by prior causes, ever, in all of human history." does nothing to undermine the argument of Free Will. Of course every choice is informed by our past...and our present. The question remains do we have a choice to act.
I think the best evidence is the mind/brain relationship. What evidence does neuroscience provide that the mind is identical to our brain, and therefore material?
Not everything that goes on in our mind is causally determined by our bodies. Sometime what goes on in our bodies is a result of what goes on in our mind. I am choosing to reply to you and do the necessary chores of getting sentences down on the screen. We have mental-to-physical causation. The explanation of both the choice I made and the physical events going on in my body is for the purpose of defending my position. A purposeful explanation is a teleological explanation and a teleological explanation is not a deterministic one.
Secondly, electrodes can be used to stimulate the brain to do different things (make a noise, raise a hand, etc.). However the patient always says something like "I didn't do that, you did that". There is no place that can be stimulated to cause a patient to decide to do something.
Lastly, while there is a causal dependency of the mind events on the brain events, you cannot confuse correlation with identity. It does not follow that if two events are correlated, that they are identical.
