What is your favourite positive argument for atheism/unbelief?

[Brian37]

I know you want to  believe Buddhism promotes the reduction of suffering, but even all their diverse majority nations and sub sects also have a history of conflict. A Tibet Buddhist does not agree with a Chinese Buddhist who doesn't agree with a Japanese Shinto Buddhist. And those competing countries have had their histories of both conflicts with each other and even power struggles within even the same countries that still lead to violence.

And Buddhism is also NOT the only label that claims to have the cure to reduce humanity's suffering. 

And you are doing the same with with "karma" that Christians do with "sin". You can only state your own individual interpretation of "karma" but it is still rooted in superstition and many Buddhists ARE superstitious as individuals. 

"peace breeds peace" I agree, but that is not due to a label. If you raise a kitten and puppy from birth they are far more likely to get along. Now again, if you have not read it, "The New Atheism" by Victor Stinger compares the claims of goals of multiple religions including those of Asia. You compare enough of the world's religions we really do all want that good side of our species, but again, that is not the club doing it, that is the individual doing it.

You are good because you the individual are good. And I am being fair because I can and will admit that there ARE atheists whom I don't like and do see as selfish and greedy and even xenophobic. China has prisons, Tibet has prisons and so does Japan. Our species behaviors, are in us, not the clubs we flock to. 

Labels, Buddhist, Christian, Muslim, Jew, Hindu and even atheist, have no magic power to make the individual only do good and always be non violent. All nations, friend and foe alike have hospitals and prisons. That says to me our behaviors are in our genes, not old clubs or old writings.

No other species has our complex language but we can see in other mammals acts of empathy and care for other members. We can also see in other mammals acts of cruelty even to other members. If you have not read that book I would highly recommend you do.

God, you're more stubborn than Drich when it comes to arguing a point that was never made. Be careful you don't become exactly what it is you're arguing against.

If you ever fancy actually reading what I've written, let me know, but until then, peace out. I've addressed everything you've said already, and for that matter agreed with most of it, so this argument is a pointless waste of both of our time because clearly we're talking past each other. That said, I still like you... whether you like me or not is your call... I just see that this is going nowhere and therefore I am choosing to disengage from the argument.

I would like you to point out in any one of my posts where I said I didn't like you. I have been consistent in saying not just to you, but my entire time here, on issues of logic, I don't give anyone a pass, not even fellow atheists. It either makes logical sense or it does not. 

I am not attacking Buddhism because I hate all Buddhists or you for that matter. I am saying that other life existed long before humans and other species display acts of compassion and acts of cruelty. I think you are reading into my posts things are not there. 

I am being fair to you. I like CL too, but I think she got it wrong. I see all religions as mere inventions of humans. I see our ability to be compassionate or cruel in our evolution, not our labels, not even the word "atheist" will magically make a human only do good. That is all I am saying. 

That said, I still like you... whether you like me or not is your call..

Glad you like me, but that is not the issue, the issue is logic and scientific fact. I like you too, but again, still not the issue.

The point is our planet is 4 billion years old and was around long before humans even started writing things down. Our universe is 13.8 billion years old and has 100s billions of galaxies. Our finite time here and our clubs will not matter in 5 billion years. The only thing I agree to right now with humans with beliefs is that they have a right to be free from violence, but even as much as I may like you, I don't see any evidence that it is any different than you found something you like. 


If you want me to say there is more logic to Buddhism, I cant do that. It has lots of pretty art and empathetic historical figures and nice motifs in the writings, sure, but no more required to the universe than I am. It too is merely 1 religion among many.  I am not saying that to burst your bubble, I am saying that because it is true for any human living, no matter the nation, no matter the power or poverty. The ride begins and ends for all of us. 

Sagan's Pale Blue dot is where I am at. Victor Stenger's "The New Atheism" is where I am at. Neil Tyson's COSMOS series is where I am at. We can disagree and even be blunt with each other without feeling like it is some desire to stab each other to death. I simply think, just like with CL a Christian, and Atlas a Muslim that those are clubs you like, but I'd say the good is in the individual and not really a requirement in science in order to explain anything about reality. 

I am ok with you and like you, but on this subject, I don't agree that you need it anymore than you would think CL needs to be a Christian or Atlas needs to be a Muslim. Outside this subject I am sure we can agree on lots. You are from what I have seen a very empathetic person as an individual.