Our theists of all labels please answer....

[emjay]

Nope, not taking the bait Brian Except to say this: one of the biggest causes of division in the world is anger. Anger leads to tunnel vision and that's where labels do the most damage. But if you can attempt to let go of anger at the source, by being mindfully aware of it, you can halt it in its tracks before it snowballs out of control, for your own sake and for the sake of others. So since it seems to me this thread can only lead to division, anger and tunnel vision, I say, no thanks.

Nobody is trying to bait anyone.

I am sorry it bothers you that I am including all religions in this thread. I would say the opposite. I would say that it is because everyone is stuck in their own corners and don't compare and dig in their heals, as much as I love the empathy of my fellow liberals, this reaction is exactly what allows the far right to cause the worst of our species divisions.

"Live and let live" is not an argument, of course we don't need more global divisions or violence. Nobody should want that. But no, sorry, if our species never questioned social norms we would not have progressed. 

This isn't a rights issue one bit so please don't try to imply that or try to hide behind it. 

I am quite sure Catholic Lady doesn't want more hate and violence.
I am quite sure that Atlas or MK don't want that either.
I like you too, and I am sure you don't want that either.

This is STRICTLY about logic and facts and reason, and trying to get people to focus that our personal beliefs cannot replace a neutral setting which has produced our modern understanding of the world through neutral scientific method. 

"Why you feel the need" to hold one club over another is precisely why the more closed societies and more bigoted violent sects in the world get away with hiding behind well intended liberals. This thread is needed and the conversation is needed. It isn't a call to end religion or get people to fight each other. It is to get more to think objectively.

Okay, I'll bite... for a while.

a) I am not a Buddhist.
b) I only trust science
c) I only trust Buddhist teachings where they agree with science. For instance, mindfulness plays a big part in many psychological therapies these days, especially in the realms of anger management. My sister is a psychologist and she uses mindfulness extensively in her work.

So can we at least get that out the way? So I am not representative of any club or religion. If Jesus had anything to say about psychology, and it made sense in line with science, I might take that advice on board too, but that wouldn't make me a Christian. So what I'm saying is I am not exclusively drawn to Buddhist teachings... I do not think it is right and everything else is wrong, I'm only drawn to teachings that make good psychological sense and agree with science.