RE: Can prayer change God's perfect plan?
May 10, 2017 at 2:00 pm
(This post was last modified: May 10, 2017 at 2:02 pm by Edwardo Piet.)
(May 10, 2017 at 1:51 pm)Aroura Wrote: If he could see all our possible choices, but not know which we chose until WE chose it, then we could have free will, in the god scenario.
Well... not if the future is still determined. Whether he can see it or not... if the future is determined we cannot do otherwise.
Also... if the future is undetermined... we can't do otherwise in any meaningful sense either! If the future is undetermined that means we can't determine our futures either.... quantum randomness controlling our actions is just as unfree!
As Sam Harris has said... to paraphrase him: The free will that most people believe in is not only impossible... but its not even possible to conceptualize... and the so-called ILLUSION of free will doesn't even exist. When people think that there's this illusion where it SEEMS like they're choosing from different options... they believe that but it's not what their experiences shows them if they actually pay attention. It's a delusion not an illusion. The illusion of free will is itself an illusion. There is no illusion of free will.
I myself have lost the illusion of that illusion. When thoughts pop into my head I know they're just popping into my head.... I know I'm not picking them and I know it NEVER SEEMED like I was.... I just made the non-sequitur most people make... I found the causes of my thoughts ultimately unknown and thereby assumed I must have chosen them.... but of course there's a regress that stretches back far past my consciousness... and when something occurs in my consciousness... it ultimately comes from unconsciousness.
I now genuinely feel like I observe my thoughts, sensations and actions rather than author them.... so no wonder I find mindfulness dumbfounding... lol. I'm already mindful. It's hard to escape the present now.
My life feels like watching a very mundane movie.
