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Theistic Inclinations
RE: Theistic Inclinations
(May 10, 2017 at 4:39 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote:
(May 10, 2017 at 3:42 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: But Chad, if a person genuinely just doesn't think God is real, how can that be held against them to such a degree that warrants going straight to Hell after they die? Don't you think God gives these people a chance? 

First, let me say that I think the scriptures are indeterminate between eternal conscious torment and annihilation. Second, let me say that I personally do not like either option. I would much prefer universalism but that is not what the scriptures teach. There isn't anyone alive that does not have some apprehension of the divine that they could either cultivate or reject.
  • "For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them. For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse. For even though they knew God, they did not honor Him as God or give thanks, but they became futile in their speculations, and their foolish heart was darkened" - Romans 1:18-21:

Likewise, the notion of a righteous atheist is a red herring. Scripture is very clear about who deserves salvation: no one.
  • "Enter not into judgment with your servant, for no one living is righteous before you." -Psalm 143:2

    "If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we say we have not sinned, we make [God] a liar, and his word is not in us. -1 John 1:8,10

    "All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned—every one—to his own way" -Isaiah 53:6

Similarly, scripture is clear that we do not attain salvation by our own efforts:
  • "He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit" -Titus 3:5).

    “No one can come to Me, unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up on the last day." -John 6:44

As you know, I do not often resort to proof-texting however since you are a Christian and presumably accept the authority of God's Word, I felt it would be profitable to do so.


Guess God just has to abide by what those scribes scribbled.  Pfft, screw god.  It's all about the book.  Boring.

(May 10, 2017 at 7:06 pm)Jörmungandr Wrote: The idea that my eternal worth hinges upon whether I accept or reject the existence of God is one of the more immoral doctrines thought up by any religion.


It isn't so bad if you don't go literal.  We know a personal afterlife makes no sense.  So better to interpret "heaven" as a current state and "God" is just the internal other, the totality of self which consciously we can only ever be part.  So it wouldn't really be about anyone's eternal worth.  Rather, one just can't have that sort of bliss and remain in a partial state in rebellion against the something more within.  Then again, nothing really rides on it.  If hell is simply the status quo it isn't exactly a lake of fire.
Reply



Messages In This Thread
Theistic Inclinations - by Adventurer - February 23, 2017 at 6:31 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Alex K - February 23, 2017 at 6:38 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Mr Greene - February 23, 2017 at 8:50 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - February 23, 2017 at 11:20 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Whateverist - February 23, 2017 at 11:34 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - February 23, 2017 at 12:14 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Mr Greene - February 24, 2017 at 4:32 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Angrboda - February 24, 2017 at 4:59 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by The Grand Nudger - February 23, 2017 at 12:05 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by The Grand Nudger - February 23, 2017 at 2:58 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Mr Greene - February 23, 2017 at 7:58 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - February 24, 2017 at 10:49 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - February 23, 2017 at 8:05 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by chimp3 - February 23, 2017 at 8:21 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by downbeatplumb - February 24, 2017 at 2:26 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by chimp3 - February 24, 2017 at 6:48 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by TheoneandonlytrueGod - February 27, 2017 at 10:28 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - February 24, 2017 at 5:13 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Aoi Magi - February 24, 2017 at 10:34 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Mister Agenda - February 24, 2017 at 11:13 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Astreja - February 24, 2017 at 12:23 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by The Grand Nudger - February 24, 2017 at 12:33 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Astreja - February 24, 2017 at 2:15 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by MysticKnight - February 24, 2017 at 2:23 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Jesster - February 24, 2017 at 2:26 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - February 24, 2017 at 5:14 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Harry Nevis - February 24, 2017 at 3:13 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by WinterHold - February 24, 2017 at 5:58 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by brewer - February 24, 2017 at 6:17 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by The Grand Nudger - February 24, 2017 at 2:25 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Astreja - February 24, 2017 at 4:13 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - February 24, 2017 at 6:08 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by WinterHold - February 24, 2017 at 6:12 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - February 24, 2017 at 6:13 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by WinterHold - February 24, 2017 at 6:22 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - February 24, 2017 at 7:22 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - February 24, 2017 at 6:18 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Angrboda - February 24, 2017 at 9:32 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Amarok - May 9, 2017 at 5:36 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 9, 2017 at 9:10 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Amarok - February 24, 2017 at 6:21 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - February 28, 2017 at 12:54 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Whateverist - May 8, 2017 at 9:41 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 8, 2017 at 1:23 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Whateverist - May 8, 2017 at 4:22 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 9, 2017 at 10:08 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Whateverist - May 9, 2017 at 10:34 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 9, 2017 at 11:48 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Whateverist - May 9, 2017 at 2:37 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Harry Nevis - May 10, 2017 at 9:34 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by drfuzzy - May 9, 2017 at 1:55 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Whateverist - May 10, 2017 at 9:43 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 10, 2017 at 9:48 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Harry Nevis - May 10, 2017 at 10:50 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by RoadRunner79 - May 10, 2017 at 11:07 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Grandizer - May 10, 2017 at 12:01 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 10, 2017 at 1:10 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 10, 2017 at 2:00 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 10, 2017 at 2:18 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Harry Nevis - May 10, 2017 at 2:37 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Catholic_Lady - May 10, 2017 at 3:42 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 10, 2017 at 4:39 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Catholic_Lady - May 10, 2017 at 5:46 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Whateverist - May 10, 2017 at 11:31 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by The Valkyrie - May 10, 2017 at 11:47 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by RoadRunner79 - May 11, 2017 at 10:07 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Whateverist - May 11, 2017 at 10:24 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by RoadRunner79 - May 10, 2017 at 12:29 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Harry Nevis - May 10, 2017 at 2:03 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Amarok - May 10, 2017 at 11:27 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 10, 2017 at 12:55 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 10, 2017 at 4:17 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Catholic_Lady - May 10, 2017 at 4:22 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 10, 2017 at 4:49 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 10, 2017 at 5:03 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Harry Nevis - May 11, 2017 at 9:38 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 10, 2017 at 5:10 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 10, 2017 at 5:55 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Catholic_Lady - May 10, 2017 at 7:19 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Silver - May 10, 2017 at 7:22 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 10, 2017 at 7:31 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Catholic_Lady - May 10, 2017 at 7:34 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by The Valkyrie - May 10, 2017 at 7:32 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Angrboda - May 10, 2017 at 7:06 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by WinterHold - May 10, 2017 at 7:24 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Silver - May 10, 2017 at 7:28 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by WinterHold - May 10, 2017 at 7:46 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Silver - May 10, 2017 at 7:48 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by WinterHold - May 10, 2017 at 7:58 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Silver - May 10, 2017 at 8:02 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by WinterHold - May 10, 2017 at 8:23 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Silver - May 10, 2017 at 8:27 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by WinterHold - May 10, 2017 at 10:35 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Cyberman - May 11, 2017 at 9:14 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Mister Agenda - May 11, 2017 at 8:59 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Harry Nevis - May 11, 2017 at 10:09 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Angrboda - May 10, 2017 at 9:01 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Catholic_Lady - May 10, 2017 at 7:30 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Silver - May 10, 2017 at 7:36 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Catholic_Lady - May 10, 2017 at 7:44 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 10, 2017 at 7:35 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 10, 2017 at 7:37 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by The Valkyrie - May 10, 2017 at 8:03 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Amarok - May 10, 2017 at 10:05 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Catholic_Lady - May 10, 2017 at 10:18 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Amarok - May 10, 2017 at 10:56 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Catholic_Lady - May 10, 2017 at 10:40 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by WinterHold - May 10, 2017 at 11:07 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Whateverist - May 10, 2017 at 11:59 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by The Valkyrie - May 11, 2017 at 12:04 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Whateverist - May 11, 2017 at 12:05 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by The Valkyrie - May 11, 2017 at 12:07 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Whateverist - May 11, 2017 at 8:57 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Mister Agenda - May 11, 2017 at 9:22 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 11, 2017 at 9:50 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Harry Nevis - May 11, 2017 at 10:32 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Catholic_Lady - May 11, 2017 at 10:35 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Harry Nevis - May 11, 2017 at 11:00 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Catholic_Lady - May 11, 2017 at 11:10 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by RoadRunner79 - May 11, 2017 at 10:35 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 11, 2017 at 2:57 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 11, 2017 at 3:23 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Grandizer - May 11, 2017 at 4:38 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 11, 2017 at 5:41 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Mister Agenda - May 12, 2017 at 9:52 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 12, 2017 at 10:29 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 11, 2017 at 5:34 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Mister Agenda - May 11, 2017 at 10:08 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Silver - May 11, 2017 at 10:16 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 11, 2017 at 11:09 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Harry Nevis - May 11, 2017 at 2:44 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by bennyboy - May 11, 2017 at 2:58 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 12, 2017 at 9:54 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by FatAndFaithless - May 11, 2017 at 2:49 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Athene - May 11, 2017 at 5:35 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Amarok - May 11, 2017 at 6:07 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 11, 2017 at 6:11 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 12, 2017 at 9:21 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 12, 2017 at 9:43 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Catholic_Lady - May 12, 2017 at 9:49 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 12, 2017 at 9:51 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Harry Nevis - May 12, 2017 at 12:54 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 12, 2017 at 1:46 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Harry Nevis - May 12, 2017 at 2:01 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Whateverist - May 12, 2017 at 10:48 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Amarok - May 12, 2017 at 11:33 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Little lunch - May 12, 2017 at 7:15 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Catholic_Lady - May 12, 2017 at 12:01 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 12, 2017 at 12:19 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Silver - May 12, 2017 at 12:24 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 12, 2017 at 1:30 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by FatAndFaithless - May 12, 2017 at 1:32 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Grandizer - May 12, 2017 at 12:30 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Catholic_Lady - May 12, 2017 at 12:54 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Grandizer - May 12, 2017 at 1:01 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Aroura - May 12, 2017 at 12:41 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 12, 2017 at 12:47 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Harry Nevis - May 12, 2017 at 1:03 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Amarok - May 12, 2017 at 1:42 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Catholic_Lady - May 12, 2017 at 1:48 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by downbeatplumb - May 12, 2017 at 1:36 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 12, 2017 at 1:54 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 12, 2017 at 1:40 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Catholic_Lady - May 12, 2017 at 1:18 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Aroura - May 12, 2017 at 3:23 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 12, 2017 at 1:35 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by FatAndFaithless - May 12, 2017 at 1:39 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 12, 2017 at 1:46 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 12, 2017 at 1:55 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 12, 2017 at 2:44 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by downbeatplumb - May 13, 2017 at 2:11 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 12, 2017 at 2:18 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 12, 2017 at 2:47 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 12, 2017 at 2:51 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 12, 2017 at 3:16 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 12, 2017 at 3:36 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Amarok - May 12, 2017 at 2:50 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Amarok - May 12, 2017 at 2:57 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 12, 2017 at 3:01 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Amarok - May 12, 2017 at 3:12 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Cyberman - May 12, 2017 at 3:13 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 12, 2017 at 3:14 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 12, 2017 at 3:46 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 12, 2017 at 4:45 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Aroura - May 12, 2017 at 4:21 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Cyberman - May 12, 2017 at 4:41 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 12, 2017 at 4:43 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Catholic_Lady - May 12, 2017 at 4:44 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 12, 2017 at 4:55 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Catholic_Lady - May 12, 2017 at 4:59 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 12, 2017 at 5:01 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Mister Agenda - May 12, 2017 at 5:03 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 12, 2017 at 5:00 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Grandizer - May 12, 2017 at 9:37 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Catholic_Lady - May 12, 2017 at 9:44 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Grandizer - May 12, 2017 at 9:49 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Catholic_Lady - May 12, 2017 at 4:54 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Cyberman - May 12, 2017 at 5:01 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 12, 2017 at 5:06 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Cyberman - May 12, 2017 at 5:12 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 12, 2017 at 5:42 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Cyberman - May 12, 2017 at 5:03 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Catholic_Lady - May 12, 2017 at 5:05 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 12, 2017 at 5:13 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 12, 2017 at 5:44 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Amarok - May 12, 2017 at 10:01 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Aroura - May 13, 2017 at 2:38 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Amarok - May 13, 2017 at 3:21 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 13, 2017 at 9:29 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Whateverist - May 13, 2017 at 9:45 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 13, 2017 at 9:55 am
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Catholic_Lady - May 13, 2017 at 1:41 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Aroura - May 13, 2017 at 1:44 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 13, 2017 at 1:56 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Neo-Scholastic - May 13, 2017 at 2:34 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Whateverist - May 13, 2017 at 4:03 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 13, 2017 at 3:56 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Edwardo Piet - May 13, 2017 at 4:06 pm
RE: Theistic Inclinations - by Zenith - May 13, 2017 at 4:21 pm

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