Theists: how do you account for psychopaths?

[Edwardo Piet]

That is simply wrong. Reason are not either valid or invalid. Reasons are just statements of rationale.

Incorrect. Either you have a valid argument or you don't. There's also the matter of whether your premises are sound, of course. But assuming that your premises are indeed sound then your reasons certainly have to be valid. You can't just start with sound premises and then make non-sequiturs and expect to be considered rational. Non-sequiturs are the opposite of rational.

Take the murder example. My reasons are: increase my security, alleviate my suffering, or create some happiness for me. These are not invalid reasons.

What are your premises? And are they sound?

It makes no sense to start with a premise that says X is wrong for everyone else but not for me. Because you have absolutely no rational justification for special pleading.

It is your opinion that they are not sufficient reasons. Why? 

There's nothing wrong with your reasons as long as you accept that the same applies to everyone else and it's also wrong for you to murder others because it increases their suffering. Again, it is irrational to fall to special pleading. Bias is irrational: Like I said, this is why the veil of ignorance thought experiment is objective and fair.

Big time question begging. Again, answer the question why is causing the suffering of others wrong --especially since I might have reasons to do so. 

That's a nonsensical question as the axiom is that suffering is wrong in the first place. If you're asking me to prove that suffering is wrong that's just silly. Once we accept that needless suffering is, obviously, bad, then we can get objective answers to questions based on that.

In case you didn't know: All objective fields start with axioms.

Pointing out the subjective nature of morality is not special pleading.

That is not what I said. I said saying that the rules only apply to your suffering is special pleading. Why is your suffering any more special than anyone else's? You have absolutely no justification for such a bias. Either needless suffering is bad or it isn't.

You moved the goal post. I did not say "needless suffering".

I didn't move the goal post at all. The whole time I've been saying that needless suffering is bad. Yes, you did not say needless suffering. *I* said needless suffering.

I listed three reasons why and you have not told me why my reasons are wrong.

Yes I have. Because it's special pleading to say that only your suffering matters.

I said that needless suffering is bad, and your response was to say why shouldn't you only care about your own and no one else's. My response: Because you have no justification for that special pleading. If suffering is bad full stop it makes no sense to say it's only bad for you and not for anyone else.

Fair warning, if you do, I am going to ask why to whatever answer you give. 

I've already told you. If we accept that needless suffering is morally bad then it makes no sense to say that only yours is bad. That is bias and special pleading. If it's bad full stop it's bad for everyone, you'd need a justification to say that yours mattered more than everyone else's and you haven't got that justification.

The veil of ignorance is a political theory about rights of a group. I am 100% sure I can get away with murder. Why should I refrain?

You don't understand the veil of ignorance if you are going to dismiss it like that. The point is that by eliminating bias you are more objective and the best way to eliminate bias of all is to not know which person you are going to be when you are born into the world. Like I said, there's absolutely no justification for saying that one person's suffering matters more than another's... so to say that yours matters more needs a justification.

You should refrain from murder because it would cause suffering for yourself and others.

If you say you only care about your own. So what? Who cares what you care about? It's still wrong for you to make others to suffer as well. Like I said, you've got no justification whatsoever for considering yourself special. Everyone's self-interest matters to themselves. You aren't special. Everyone matters.