Question to theists

[Drich]

Yes because there is no bar to over come or in some cases to float over. Once God removed the bar it simply became a matter of doing your best. which means God does not demand we live sin free but simply try and do our best.

If you paint everything right and wrong you would have conditional heaven. meaning you would have to meet every rule. even when you 'good people' make up your own morality, you are not able to all agree on every rule.

I have no problem at all with people trying to do their best.  I do, however, see no special role for religious belief in the process.  If a believer and a non-believer both put forth the same effort, I think they should be treated the same.

Kinda the point. Jesus if you followed his life was very anti religious.

The "point" of all of this is to have direct contact with God. free from the 'responsibilities of morality.' 'morality' being a substitute for the atonement God offers.

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Interesting how that works out.  Christians have carte blanche to be utterly deplorable...but an atheist is going to be tortured forever no matter how decent they are.

There;s that noise again...I swear to christ it sounds like somebody is trapped in a box far...far away.....

Again white bread... its all a matter of perspective isn't it. your "decent guy" could be my ted bundy. You've/pop culture/pop morality has taken it upon yourselves to judge who is and who is not 'decent,' by using an ever sliding scale.

Let's say you live in a realm where the worst thing you could do is tell 1 white lie a day. Now Imagine how the man who told 1 white lie every day would be perceived.. this man would be a monster in that realm as he is at the max evil he can be. now imagine the guy who tells two white lies every day... this man could be considered the devil because he is beyond the normal scope of right and wrong...

But in when you compare these men with the level of evil you are willing to tolerate they are saints.

Here's the thing though, who judges who is righteous and who is not. is it your deplorible standard of right and wrong, or is it the standard of righteousness and atonement that is used?

IF God said we use the standard of right and wrong we are responsible to be never wrong, as that is the only way you can earn your way into righteousness.

Otherwise we must seek atonement and abandon the idea of being right 'enough' or a decent guy

Fore a man who will not yield his pride to seek atonement rather than abandon his sliding scale of right and wrong truly is a wicked man. as he will ultimately try and justify any sin if given enough time to live. meaning at some point a proud man who can not admit to his sin and will not seek atonement, but yet hold on the the archaic idea of morality being his guide will ultimately succumb to keep lowering his bar of morality until ultimately he justifies all sin. meaning all evil will someday be 'moral'. which is why "a decent bloke" is an egg of evil waiting to hatch sometime in eternity future.