(June 29, 2018 at 4:43 pm)possibletarian Wrote:Also he's wrong the earliest Christians were not like the ones who wrote the bible he's inventing consistency(June 29, 2018 at 9:43 am)SteveII Wrote: Regarding all of your comments above:
-- We are wired to believe in the supernatural
I'm not sure that can be true, I don't believe we are pre-wired at all. I do perhaps think we all wonder about a life after out body dies, in other words we cannot imagine what not existing must be like, hence our search for a 'beyond' to our life and perhaps dreaming of our loved ones led us to believe (or at least hope) there could be an afterlife.
Most early religions were built this way a belief in the spirits of ancestors, some in re-incarnation, many believed in multiple spirits and eventually distinct gods and later in the day monotheism. To claim a hard wiring is to put the conclusion (something must have hard wired us) before the question.
Add to that the many different beliefs it seems so scattered and in disarray that it's hard to imagine any intelligence of worth behind it, all of them seem to be built on a hope or fear of death or what happens to us after death. I was indoctrinated to believe in a supernatural world, but upon asking question about it do not believe it's a valid proposition, so i (along with other atheists) have somehow overcome this built in belief.
Quote:-- To most people, a miracle, a story, listening to people's experiences with the supernatural is not considered impossible.
-- If it is possible, then context is examined.
You mean to most people who have been taught there is a world beyond our own ?
Quote:For example, the Mark 2 story about the paralytic man. If I heard today that a paralytic man was healed out of the blue. I would say "perhaps". If it was related to me this story:
5 When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralyzed man, “Son, your sins are forgiven.”6 Now some teachers of the law were sitting there, thinking to themselves, 7 “Why does this fellow talk like that? He’s blaspheming! Who can forgive sins but God alone?” 8 Immediately Jesus knew in his spirit that this was what they were thinking in their hearts, and he said to them, “Why are you thinking these things? 9 Which is easier: to say to this paralyzed man, ‘Your sins are forgiven,’ or to say, ‘Get up, take your mat and walk’? 10 But I want you to know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins.” So he said to the man, 11 “I tell you, get up, take your mat and go home.” 12 He got up, took his mat and walked out in full view of them all.
Well i suspect you do believe that, I however do not believe it happened as I have seen nothing like it that i can refer to.
Quote:Why believe the Bible and not some random claim in remote parts of India? No context is provided that makes sense. If some context is offered, does it fit into a wider context that continues to make sense? and so on.
Why would it have to be in context to be valid miracle.. for someone who believes they happen ?
Quote:You don't believe the Bible is Holy therefore the content is true. You believe the content is true and the Bible becomes Holy.
There is nothing in the bible that leads me to believe it's true at least from a spiritual point of view.. no
Quote:The Bible and the claim are not the same thing. There is ample evidence that people believed the content for decades prior to the current books of the Bible being written. So, how can they be the same thing if one preceded the other?
Well there is ample evidence that people believe the Quran, or the teachings of Joseph Smith, we don't doubt that many believe, and had a belief before they were written and i'm uncertain what your point is.
But you really don't see the problem quoting a story book for evidence that the same book is real, the fact that they believed it before just shows how easily they could be fooled into believing it.
Seek strength, not to be greater than my brother, but to fight my greatest enemy -- myself.
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