(September 27, 2018 at 11:26 pm)bennyboy Wrote:(September 27, 2018 at 11:04 pm)PRJA93 Wrote: It seems some people have solidified their views on Peterson and now seemed to have fixed belief(s) about him. It is what it is, I suppose. I will continue to find value in all kinds of reading materials, including 12 Rules. It doesn't mean I have to like Peterson as a person or agree with everything he says. It's bizarre how some people have painted this guy as some sort of villain. I think he's incredibly disingenuous when it comes to religion and god and there's plenty of political views he's expressed that I don't necessarily agree with. But some hateful, right wing bigot who is just in it for the money? Um, no. I'm definitely more left-leaning than right, but jeez. Some people take things too far, even when they have good intentions.
It's not just that they want to voice their opinions of certain people or ideas, about which they already have strong opinions. They quite deliberately go into this kind of discussion with the intent of interfering with any kind of dialogue or interest, as a tactic of making sure memes they don't agree with can't be considered-- the shit that this thread has become being a pretty clear case in point. This is not coincidental or accidental. Basically, it's "You have complete freedom to agree with us unconditionally, or to stay quiet, or to be drowned out by irrelevant rants and ad hom attacks." Civil and measured dialogue about specific ideas (for example, limited in scope to the text of a book) is not one of the options they are willing to extend.
I'd say the fantastic success of the Peterson vs. Harris debates shows how eager people are to step away from the internet trolls and see discussions that AREN'T done like that. (I'd say overall Harris is the stronger debater and is more prepared for this kind of arena, but they are still very interesting discussions)
I'd definitely have to side with Harris as well, though I may be biased because he's much more liberal than Peterson in my opinion and that's more palatable for me. The thing is, I don't know if some liberals are willfully misrepresenting figures like Peterson, but I think some of them are. I think a good number of them don't really realize what they're doing BECAUSE they're so entrenched in particular fixed beliefs. The fact that some people can truly interpret Peterson's words, process them and then say, "This man is a bigot" and ACTUALLY seem to believe it, seems to tell me they're not making a conscious choice to misinterpret things, but rather their lens is skewed.
It reminds me a lot of when Ben Affleck went onto Real Time with Bill Maher and got into it with Sam Harris about Islam. No matter what Harris said, Affleck continued to interpret everything he was saying as racist or "Islamophobic," despite the fact that Harris was simply stating facts and quoting statistics. It's as if they're hearing something different than what is being said.
To be completely fair, this obviously happens on the right as well. I consider myself a liberal and have always voted Democrat. It surprises me how differently many conservatives interpret simple liberal ideas. It happens on both sides.
Also, a lot of Peterson's hardcore fan base seems to fall much farther to the right than Peterson himself. Probably another example of his words and ideas being skewed through crooked lenses.
If you're frightened of dying, and you're holding on, you'll see devils tearing your life away. But if you've made your peace, then the devils are really angels, freeing you from the Earth.
