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Christian Looking For Debate
#55
RE: Christian Looking For Debate
(October 30, 2011 at 4:31 am)SeekerOfTruth Wrote: First, yes I am through all of the rough times thanks for caring. And yes I do care if its true or not. And for Pascal's Wager that's a really good point that I have a responses myself.

I've studied a lot of different religions and at least the basics of almost all of them. And I'm convinced, no matter how much my fellow Christians would disagree, That Jews, Christians, and Muslims all follow the same God. Even the Qur'an touches on this idea: "And remember Allah took a Covenant from the People of the Book, to make it known and clear to mankind, and not to hide it" (3:187 AYA) The "people of the book" mentioned in this verse are the Jews and Christians whom the Qur'an commands are to be respected for they honor the same God. In a way by being Christian if Judaism or Islam are true rather than Christianity I'm still covered. However, that still leaves out what if Hinduism or the Norse Mythology is right.

As for the last comment. Yes, I am very interested in the other answers to "what have I got to lose?"

Ok, the fact that you care about your beliefs being true is good. Now yes, those three religions all come from one source and split off some way down the line from each other. So I'm happy enough that you could argue that all followers of those religions are working for the same God (though I can't think why you'd want to affiliate yourself with Islam in any way). But you've already highlighted the problem yourself. There are literally thousands of religions in the world, from Hinduism to Jainism to Cargo Cults to Scientology to Greek mythology. The religions are in no way compatible with each other, so you cannot believe them all. This is where Pascal's Wager falls down. How are you going to solve this problem?

So you said you care about your beliefs being true. So the first thing to realise is that being comforted by something does not make it true, in any way. Some children are comforted by a blanket or an old toy, but we can safely assume that the things do not themselves have any safeguarding properties. Adults take comfort in 'spirit mediums', astrology, homeopathy and the aforementioned thousands of worldwide religions, the power of which I hope you won't be arguing for. So the question is: What evidence is there to believe that Christianity provides an accurate representation of the world? Bearing in mind that the Bible contains many factual errors, as well as claims that have never been substantiated (flood, exodus etc). I don't know how literally you take the Bible, but it makes some fairly outlandish claims that there is simply no evidence for.

Finally, I was going to rattle off a list of things 'to lose' by being religious, but they all basically come under one banner to a large degree. Essentially, I believe when you follow a religion such as Christianity, you sacrifice your intellectual integrity and individuality. You aren't able to make up your own mind on issues of morality, because you are already instructed what to think. Even if you don't openly loathe homosexuals, for instance, you are conditioned to think certain things about them. That's just one among many examples. You're forced to struggle between where the evidence points and what your religion has taught you to be true. You end up either happily condemning people to eternal torment for what they believe, or its more benign form, worrying about the fate of people you care about and perhaps trying to encourage them to 'switch sides' to avoid damnation. You're encouraged to believe yourself part of a chosen tribe who carry favour with the creator of the universe, which can give people a false sense of entitlement.

I've really only just begun to scratch the surface, but that's enough to mull over for the time being.
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Messages In This Thread
Christian Looking For Debate - by SeekerOfTruth - October 26, 2011 at 4:42 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by DeistPaladin - October 26, 2011 at 4:51 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by The Grand Nudger - October 26, 2011 at 4:52 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by SeekerOfTruth - October 26, 2011 at 6:33 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by reverendjeremiah - October 26, 2011 at 6:20 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Ace Otana - October 26, 2011 at 6:27 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Doubting Thomas - October 26, 2011 at 6:33 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by SeekerOfTruth - October 26, 2011 at 7:24 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Cinjin - October 26, 2011 at 8:20 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by SeekerOfTruth - October 26, 2011 at 9:29 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Cinjin - October 27, 2011 at 2:52 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Mister Agenda - October 27, 2011 at 12:36 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by TheDarkestOfAngels - October 26, 2011 at 10:28 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by TheDarkestOfAngels - October 26, 2011 at 6:39 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by justthetruth - November 5, 2011 at 3:22 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Erinome - November 5, 2011 at 3:32 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by ElDinero - November 5, 2011 at 12:29 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by frankiej - November 5, 2011 at 12:33 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Darwinian - November 5, 2011 at 1:23 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Blam! - November 5, 2011 at 4:32 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Joe Bloe - November 7, 2011 at 8:02 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Mister Agenda - November 7, 2011 at 7:41 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Minimalist - October 26, 2011 at 7:12 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by padraic - October 26, 2011 at 7:14 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by SeekerOfTruth - October 26, 2011 at 7:53 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by The Grand Nudger - October 26, 2011 at 7:27 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by fr0d0 - October 26, 2011 at 8:00 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by The Grand Nudger - October 26, 2011 at 8:02 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Minimalist - October 26, 2011 at 8:12 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by The Grand Nudger - October 26, 2011 at 8:15 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by The Grand Nudger - October 26, 2011 at 8:23 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Jackalope - October 26, 2011 at 9:24 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by padraic - October 26, 2011 at 10:46 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by SeekerOfTruth - October 26, 2011 at 11:18 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Erinome - October 27, 2011 at 5:46 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by toro - October 27, 2011 at 10:47 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Norfolk And Chance - November 12, 2011 at 9:23 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by The Grand Nudger - October 26, 2011 at 11:23 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by ElDinero - October 27, 2011 at 4:41 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by 5thHorseman - October 27, 2011 at 4:44 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Zen Badger - October 27, 2011 at 9:16 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Doubting Thomas - October 27, 2011 at 10:33 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by JollyForr - October 27, 2011 at 10:54 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Minimalist - October 27, 2011 at 11:57 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by downbeatplumb - October 27, 2011 at 12:20 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Minimalist - October 28, 2011 at 12:01 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Cinjin - October 28, 2011 at 12:10 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Doubting Thomas - October 27, 2011 at 12:23 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by downbeatplumb - October 27, 2011 at 12:26 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Minimalist - October 28, 2011 at 12:26 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Jackalope - October 28, 2011 at 3:43 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Minimalist - November 1, 2011 at 3:10 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by kılıç_mehmet - October 28, 2011 at 4:34 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by padraic - October 28, 2011 at 7:32 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by kılıç_mehmet - October 30, 2011 at 10:29 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Mister Agenda - October 28, 2011 at 3:56 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by SeekerOfTruth - October 29, 2011 at 1:03 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Cinjin - October 29, 2011 at 1:46 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by SeekerOfTruth - October 29, 2011 at 2:24 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Blam! - October 29, 2011 at 10:00 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by SeekerOfTruth - October 30, 2011 at 4:31 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by downbeatplumb - October 30, 2011 at 5:28 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by ElDinero - October 30, 2011 at 8:08 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by SeekerOfTruth - November 7, 2011 at 10:36 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Joe Bloe - October 30, 2011 at 8:26 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Mister Agenda - November 1, 2011 at 2:50 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by ElDinero - October 29, 2011 at 8:23 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Joe Bloe - October 29, 2011 at 9:07 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by The Grand Nudger - October 29, 2011 at 9:31 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by The Grand Nudger - October 30, 2011 at 10:15 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Blam! - November 1, 2011 at 10:51 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by justthetruth - November 5, 2011 at 3:02 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Erinome - November 5, 2011 at 3:16 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Cinjin - November 5, 2011 at 1:39 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Minimalist - November 5, 2011 at 1:45 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by LastPoet - November 5, 2011 at 3:18 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Cinjin - November 5, 2011 at 3:32 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Minimalist - November 5, 2011 at 4:22 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by 5thHorseman - November 5, 2011 at 4:02 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by padraic - November 5, 2011 at 4:17 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by DeistPaladin - November 5, 2011 at 4:34 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Minimalist - November 5, 2011 at 4:35 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Darwinian - November 5, 2011 at 4:40 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Blam! - November 5, 2011 at 4:49 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by 5thHorseman - November 5, 2011 at 4:48 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Minimalist - November 5, 2011 at 5:09 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by DeistPaladin - November 5, 2011 at 5:21 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Blam! - November 5, 2011 at 5:27 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Minimalist - November 7, 2011 at 2:38 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Minimalist - November 7, 2011 at 10:47 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by SeekerOfTruth - November 7, 2011 at 11:22 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Mister Agenda - November 8, 2011 at 1:05 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by justthetruth - November 8, 2011 at 1:29 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by HeyItsZeus - November 8, 2011 at 1:41 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by ElDinero - November 8, 2011 at 2:34 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 8, 2011 at 1:23 am
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by 5thHorseman - November 8, 2011 at 1:57 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Tiberius - November 8, 2011 at 3:00 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by ElDinero - November 8, 2011 at 3:06 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Joe Bloe - November 8, 2011 at 3:33 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Minimalist - November 8, 2011 at 4:47 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by ElDinero - November 8, 2011 at 4:53 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Minimalist - November 8, 2011 at 10:08 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Mister Agenda - November 11, 2011 at 2:37 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 11, 2011 at 2:54 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Minimalist - November 12, 2011 at 10:31 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by J.D. - November 19, 2011 at 4:40 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by fr0d0 - November 19, 2011 at 6:25 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Norfolk And Chance - November 20, 2011 at 1:44 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Minimalist - November 19, 2011 at 6:53 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 20, 2011 at 12:28 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by fr0d0 - November 20, 2011 at 2:59 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Norfolk And Chance - November 20, 2011 at 5:22 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Epimethean - November 20, 2011 at 4:05 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by fr0d0 - November 20, 2011 at 4:39 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by downbeatplumb - November 20, 2011 at 5:18 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Epimethean - November 20, 2011 at 4:55 pm
RE: Christian Looking For Debate - by Minimalist - November 20, 2011 at 6:41 pm

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