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Good read on consciousness
#24
RE: Good read on consciousness
Pseudo-consciousness is likely what we will create in our most advanced AI. However, we probably will be able to generate real consciousness in machines, once we understand how consciousness operates.

I largely agree with the essay. Illusionists are on to something. I am not sure about all their thoughts, despite you describing them quite well.

The hard-problem is not a problem, IMO -- it is an error in describing the issue. Yes, phenomenological zombies might be able to mimic much of what it is to be conscious. But, consciousness is a process that specifically creates a sense of self, the flow of time, imagining of the future. Consciousness is not an end in itself -- it is the tool that the brain uses to allow this mass of cells to make the most intelligent choices for our survival. We could design an AI that doesn't need consciousness. Or, we could design an AI that is conscious, and then allow its consciousness to learn. We really don't want that last one, I would guess. The conscious AI would either make mistakes (like humans), or would learn at a rate that would far surpass us. I'm not sure with is worse. (there may also be different forms of consciousness that have so far never evolved)

What is the "us" that is conscious? I guess an illusion is a valid idea. But consciousness is a process. A conscious mind perceives its own reality, because that is what the consciousness process does -- it is a watcher of itself. The qualia we perceive are high level abstractions that are the phenomenological inputs to our consciousness.

Why is there a persistent sense of self if consciousness is just a process? Well, I believe our sense of self is both real and an illusion.

It is real in the sense that our memories and previous brain wiring preserve a continuity that we see as a continuous self. There is a real brain and it produces one consciousness.

It is an illlusion in the sense that our mind is really many subsystems that, through filtering, are merged into one cohesive sense of self. Also, if we were to completely lose our memories (but not our abilities) every few minutes, could we still say that we are the same person we were yesterday? I don't think so. In fact, I'm not sure I'm that same person as yesterday in that my brain has changed since then through new experiences (and even reading this forum). Do I own this consciousness? Well, I am this consciousness so I absolutely own it in this moment, but I am not the owner of tomorrow's consciousness -- tomorrow's consciousness is.

This point of view has led me to a slightly mystical philosophy, which I won't get into in this post.
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Messages In This Thread
Good read on consciousness - by Apollo - January 5, 2021 at 2:36 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by onlinebiker - January 5, 2021 at 2:45 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by The Grand Nudger - January 5, 2021 at 3:52 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by HappySkeptic - January 7, 2021 at 8:58 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by Grandizer - January 7, 2021 at 10:28 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by The Grand Nudger - January 7, 2021 at 10:55 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by Duty - January 8, 2021 at 12:28 am
RE: Good read on consciousness - by Jehanne - January 8, 2021 at 12:25 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by Grandizer - January 8, 2021 at 10:22 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by Jehanne - January 10, 2021 at 10:22 am
RE: Good read on consciousness - by The Grand Nudger - January 8, 2021 at 12:32 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by Jehanne - January 8, 2021 at 12:51 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by The Grand Nudger - January 8, 2021 at 2:02 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by HappySkeptic - January 8, 2021 at 2:28 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by The Grand Nudger - January 8, 2021 at 2:41 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by HappySkeptic - January 8, 2021 at 2:57 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by The Grand Nudger - January 8, 2021 at 3:02 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by HappySkeptic - January 8, 2021 at 3:12 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by The Grand Nudger - January 8, 2021 at 3:15 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by John 6IX Breezy - January 8, 2021 at 4:27 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by The Grand Nudger - January 8, 2021 at 4:31 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by The Grand Nudger - January 9, 2021 at 12:36 am
RE: Good read on consciousness - by Grandizer - January 9, 2021 at 4:33 am
RE: Good read on consciousness - by The Grand Nudger - January 9, 2021 at 8:54 am
RE: Good read on consciousness - by HappySkeptic - January 9, 2021 at 2:33 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by Grandizer - January 9, 2021 at 11:17 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by The Grand Nudger - January 9, 2021 at 6:48 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by The Grand Nudger - January 10, 2021 at 12:49 am
RE: Good read on consciousness - by Grandizer - January 10, 2021 at 7:36 am
RE: Good read on consciousness - by The Grand Nudger - January 10, 2021 at 7:04 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by Grandizer - January 11, 2021 at 12:47 am
RE: Good read on consciousness - by The Grand Nudger - January 11, 2021 at 2:27 am
RE: Good read on consciousness - by Grandizer - January 11, 2021 at 4:17 am
RE: Good read on consciousness - by HappySkeptic - January 11, 2021 at 11:27 am
RE: Good read on consciousness - by John 6IX Breezy - January 11, 2021 at 5:51 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by The Grand Nudger - January 11, 2021 at 12:00 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by Grandizer - January 11, 2021 at 12:25 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by The Grand Nudger - January 11, 2021 at 12:33 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by Grandizer - January 11, 2021 at 12:47 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by The Grand Nudger - January 11, 2021 at 12:55 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by Grandizer - January 11, 2021 at 8:39 pm
RE: Good read on consciousness - by The Grand Nudger - January 12, 2021 at 4:04 am

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