(April 8, 2021 at 3:03 pm)Belacqua Wrote:(April 8, 2021 at 1:41 pm)Drich Wrote: nor have they ever considered a messiah before christ nor never once considered anyone in the 2000 years after christ...
This isn't right.
Jews use the word "messiah" differently than Christians. For them, it is almost always a political leader who unites the Jews, strengthens their homeland, and gives them peace. The Christians changed it, to something more magical.
Several people have been called "messiah" over the centuries. The Old Testament calls Cyrus the Great a messiah, because he ended the Exile and allowed the Jews to return to their homeland.
Different groups of Jews have named people messiah, when not all Jews agreed on the name. I remember an orthodox community in Brooklyn who named their leader messiah about 20 or 30 years ago. Most Jews ignored it. You could probably find dozens of similar examples from history.
Yeah, just for the record, Judaism's idea of the messiah is fundamentally different from anything Christianity has ever taught and, indeed, what Christ has ever done. In Judaism, their idea of a messiah is an Alexander the Great-type figure who's going to unite the 12 tribes of Israel, convince them to follow the 613 mitzvot of the Torah, defeat her enemies, reestablish the Temple, and unite the world in a universal peace where everybody follows the God of Israel. What Christ did was spend a couple years as an itinerant preacher before getting executed, and then, his followers corrupted the law (note that the idea of Jesus "fulfilling the law" as described in Christianity is entirely foreign to Judaism), split from Judaism, and many of its powerful followers spent much of the intervening millennia persecuting Jews. And there's no Second Coming in Judaism. It's all supposed to be done in one lifetime.
Dude, just ask literally any rabbi about why Jews don't recognise Christ as the Messiah and you'll get much the same response. And any of those checklists of verses that you claim prove Jesus Christ was the Messiah, well, have you ever watched The Tudors? It stars Jonathan Rhys Meyers as Henry VIII despite his looking shockingly little like him. Even as the real-life Henry grew to 400 lbs, Rhys-Meyers' Henry stays trim. And even though he actually went through a lot of trouble to make his body language like he actually was that fat, he clearly wasn't and didn't even put on a body suit to look like it. That's basically what checklists like those are to rabbis. Paying meticulous attention to the minor details and blatantly ignoring how badly you're fucking up the bigger picture.
Comparing the Universal Oneness of All Life to Yo Mama since 2010.
I was born with the gift of laughter and a sense the world is mad.
I was born with the gift of laughter and a sense the world is mad.