Proof of existence of god.

[tackattack]

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Logic can not explain metaphysics as
they are polar opposites and completely
so. And as far as doing a bit better than to
just state we are all agnostics. Sorry but no
Or not unless one can do so with a recourse to
belief over reason. As this is the ultimate classic
example of how we some times feel need to tinker
with the actual truth of what is since it causes anxiety
Reality is just not reality if it has to be seen through an
emotional filter. I accept it no matter how uncomfortable
I find it and is a healthy attitude to possess. As world is not
made for your satisfaction or mine but is as it is whatever you
or I think and no matter how safe we feel masked by deception

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I cited specific example of some metaphysical abstract concepts that are explained logically, as did you. How then are they polar opposites and metaphysics can't be supported by logic? You're flip flopping a little here. I understand your standpoint is a substance monist are you a strict materialist as well? I think we can agree that reality is reality regardless of who is viewing it. I think we can also agree that perception and bias can't be completely factored out of observable reality. No one here is trying to tinker with the truth of anything. If you truly wish to have a dialogue I'd be happy to come to a workable concensus on whatever certain parameters you feel must be established.

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With regard to the subject in question, there isn't an ounce of agnosticism in my body. Tack, my aggressiveness towards religion could be interpreted as "hateful", but you would have to ignore the fact that my take on christianity is that it is a fundamentally bigoted and ethnocentric worldview, that there is nothing that religious faith offers that cannot be achieved through less disgusting means. Apparently those fruits you spoke of are one of those things. I use my own head as a measure of improvement btw (you don't?). When I feel that I could have handled something better, I try to do so the next time, ad infinitum. I don't think you could demonstrate any other method by which human beings do the whole self-improvement bit. I think your morality is identical to mine in origin. I wouldn't exactly put the central character of the bible in some moral limelight (as a standard to judge relative levels of "morality"), because it would be an embarrassment. Call that hateful if you like, but I'm just trying to stand up to all the nastiness we wrote into our beliefs.

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I didn't think there was Rhythm. I was paraphrasing 2compulsives " Therefore then one can reference the fact that every one is ultimately agnostic from the most evangelical fundamentalist to the most strident rationalist and everyone in between." So you hatred is based on every Christian being fundamentally bigoted and having an ethnocentric worldview, or is it just that the establishment of religion has historically been? As far as self-improvement I do agree that our personal morality originates from the same place. I use my own mind as a means of improvement as well. I believe in an objective standard though by which to improve that subjective standard. It all gets filtered though perception and the mind and rehashed as a better morality in the end though. Side note if you were just trying to stand up to all the nastiness we wrote into our beliefs, then you wouldn't need to fight back, especially since you don't share those beliefs. If you were just standing for your beliefs, then you wouldn't need to push them or be hateful to another groups beliefs. You wouldn't have to fight against those people just express yourself and brush the rest off. However, I presume since you feel religion is also an injustice, that this plays a part in the fighting against rather than standing up for.


@AtheistAaron- My frustration usually shuts down the show when I hear, "...our 5 senses..." . The video had some good points and I bet some Christians do fear rejection from God or have no solid foundation for their belief so they do react that way. I was merely pointing out that it's a generalization and just as easily reversed for atheists that exhibit those reactions. Albeit, even factoring in numbers, I would guess that atheists have a far smaller potion of anti theists than Christians that don't act Christian. It would be interesting to see the numbers on polls like that though

@And no Min the theists, want silly standards like unbiased material proof for the immaterial, thrown out as silliness. Maybe after that gets reevaluated, they might be open to an actual experience of their own to test.