Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: September 27, 2026, 10:29 pm

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Free Will Debate
#75
RE: Free Will Debate
(November 27, 2021 at 12:06 pm)Anomalocaris Wrote:
(November 27, 2021 at 11:27 am)polymath257 Wrote: Why would that be desirable? I *want* my decisions to be based on my experiences (outside events affecting me). It would be exceedingly strange if they were not.

Most likely, that small difference in my brain that 'decided' is the result great number of previous events, both inside and outside of my brain. No single one of them would be enough for a different decision, most likely. Those previous influences had to come together to affect the activity of my brain for the decision to happen.

In other words, both external and internal events affect my decisions. Duh.


I make no judgements regarding whether that is desirable.  I only ask whether that could be true.

regarding both external and internal events affect your decision.   does the doc-called internal event truly have any significant freedom to transpire differently resulting in different decisions if all external events remain the same?   if not, then there is no real internal events, only intermediate effects of external events.

it is possible the brain magnifies the chaotic nature of how decision responds to subtle changes to external events.   but other things can also magnify the chaotic nature of how effects of external events impinges on your brain.   Also, a macroscopic chaotic system is still in most cases essentially deterministic.

I *all* external events were *exactly* the same, including *all* events prior to my conception, and *all* events leading up to that decision, then no, I don't think I would make a different decision: I would be exactly the same, with the same desires and beliefs, same opportunities, and same prejudices, and so would *expect* to make the same decision.

If I *could* make a different decision, that would seem quite strange given I would be exactly the same either way.

(November 27, 2021 at 12:15 pm)Anomalocaris Wrote:
(November 27, 2021 at 12:01 pm)polymath257 Wrote: It seems that people frame 'free will' in a way that requires it to be an 'uncaused cause'. Is that seriously what people mean by 'free will'?


So, once again, what is the significance of the adjective 'free' in this context? The decision was 'made by me' in that the *decision* was an event in *my* brain. I based that decision on my experiences, desires, thoughts, etc. How is that *not* free?


what meaning is there in “made by me” if there is no possibility of your making a different decision under each circumstance?

That the significant information processing occurred in my brain. In other words, by me.

Once again, is the definition of 'free will' such that it requires the decision be an uncaused cause?
Reply



Messages In This Thread
Free Will Debate - by Alan V - November 23, 2021 at 2:32 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - November 23, 2021 at 3:04 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by Alan V - November 23, 2021 at 3:48 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - November 23, 2021 at 4:11 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by Alan V - November 23, 2021 at 5:07 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - November 23, 2021 at 5:20 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - November 23, 2021 at 3:07 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 23, 2021 at 3:24 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by Jehanne - November 23, 2021 at 4:21 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by Angrboda - November 23, 2021 at 9:00 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by Oldandeasilyconfused - November 24, 2021 at 1:27 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by Ranjr - November 24, 2021 at 2:29 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by brewer - November 24, 2021 at 7:26 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by Jehanne - November 24, 2021 at 8:16 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by brewer - November 24, 2021 at 9:53 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by Anomalocaris - November 24, 2021 at 11:26 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by slartibartfast - November 25, 2021 at 2:42 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by Jehanne - November 25, 2021 at 1:01 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 23, 2021 at 4:24 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by Alan V - November 23, 2021 at 8:50 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by Oldandeasilyconfused - November 23, 2021 at 4:35 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by Kitan Etos - November 23, 2021 at 8:54 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 23, 2021 at 8:56 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 23, 2021 at 9:32 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by no one - November 24, 2021 at 2:35 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - November 24, 2021 at 4:22 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by Anomalocaris - November 24, 2021 at 2:18 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - November 24, 2021 at 3:02 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 24, 2021 at 7:32 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - November 24, 2021 at 11:48 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by Jehanne - November 24, 2021 at 1:07 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - November 24, 2021 at 1:40 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by Jehanne - November 24, 2021 at 8:51 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by Duty - November 24, 2021 at 7:45 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 24, 2021 at 7:48 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by Neo-Scholastic - November 24, 2021 at 10:03 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 24, 2021 at 3:24 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by Anomalocaris - November 24, 2021 at 3:45 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - November 24, 2021 at 3:49 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 24, 2021 at 3:58 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - November 24, 2021 at 4:22 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 24, 2021 at 4:26 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by polymath257 - November 24, 2021 at 8:37 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by Anomalocaris - November 25, 2021 at 9:31 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 24, 2021 at 9:18 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by Jehanne - November 24, 2021 at 9:22 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by slartibartfast - November 25, 2021 at 2:54 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by Jehanne - November 25, 2021 at 3:30 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 25, 2021 at 4:33 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by HappySkeptic - November 26, 2021 at 5:41 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 26, 2021 at 5:47 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by polymath257 - November 26, 2021 at 9:36 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by Anomalocaris - November 27, 2021 at 4:37 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - November 27, 2021 at 5:24 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by polymath257 - November 27, 2021 at 10:13 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by Anomalocaris - November 27, 2021 at 11:18 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by polymath257 - November 27, 2021 at 11:27 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by Anomalocaris - November 27, 2021 at 12:06 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by polymath257 - November 27, 2021 at 12:24 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by Anomalocaris - November 27, 2021 at 1:09 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by Jehanne - November 26, 2021 at 7:56 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 26, 2021 at 10:34 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by polymath257 - November 27, 2021 at 10:59 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - November 27, 2021 at 11:10 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by polymath257 - November 27, 2021 at 11:18 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - November 27, 2021 at 11:44 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by polymath257 - November 27, 2021 at 11:58 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by Jehanne - November 27, 2021 at 8:40 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 27, 2021 at 10:38 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by polymath257 - November 27, 2021 at 10:51 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - November 27, 2021 at 10:54 am
RE: Free Will Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 27, 2021 at 12:01 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by polymath257 - November 27, 2021 at 12:01 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by Anomalocaris - November 27, 2021 at 12:15 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 27, 2021 at 12:07 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 27, 2021 at 12:23 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 27, 2021 at 12:25 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by polymath257 - November 27, 2021 at 12:28 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 27, 2021 at 1:12 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by Anomalocaris - November 27, 2021 at 1:36 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by polymath257 - November 27, 2021 at 4:58 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by Anomalocaris - November 27, 2021 at 5:50 pm
RE: Free Will Debate - by The Grand Nudger - November 27, 2021 at 7:08 pm

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Do you believe in free will? Disagreeable 37 8728 August 4, 2024 at 7:15 am
Last Post: Disagreeable
  Understanding the rudiment has much to give helps free that mind for further work. highdimensionman 16 4348 May 24, 2022 at 6:31 am
Last Post: highdimensionman
  A 'proof' of God's existence - free will mrj 54 17965 August 9, 2020 at 10:25 am
Last Post: Sal
  Debate Invitation John 6IX Breezy 3 1658 September 1, 2019 at 2:05 pm
Last Post: John 6IX Breezy
Thumbs Up VOTE HERE: Final four questions for the Christian Debate vulcanlogician 43 11956 May 18, 2018 at 10:23 am
Last Post: Edwardo Piet
  1st Call for Christian Only Debate: Our Role on AF Neo-Scholastic 132 39269 May 4, 2018 at 12:11 pm
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  Oh no not another free will thread. Edwardo Piet 309 98725 April 29, 2018 at 11:45 am
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  WLC, Free Will, and God's divine foreknowledge SuperSentient 15 6473 April 1, 2017 at 2:50 am
Last Post: bennyboy
  Why free will probably does not exist, and why we should stop treating people - WisdomOfTheTrees 22 9409 February 8, 2017 at 7:43 pm
Last Post: WisdomOfTheTrees
  The Definitive Post On The Free Will v. Determinism Debate BrianSoddingBoru4 17 6507 September 3, 2016 at 11:20 pm
Last Post: Arkilogue



Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)