(July 26, 2022 at 4:20 am)pocaracas Wrote: Fine, I'll bite"True, that's why astrophysics posits that the total energy of the Universe is ZERO!"
(July 25, 2022 at 10:02 pm)Billy Bob Wrote: Evidence points to nothing does nothing.
True, that's why astrophysics posits that the total energy of the Universe is ZERO!
If the total energy of the Universe prior (if this makes any sense) to the Big Bang was Zero, then conservation of energy requires that it is also zero after the big bang. Zero energy implies that Entropy cannot increase, thus the second law of thermodynamics applies in the limit of no change.
(July 25, 2022 at 10:02 pm)Billy Bob Wrote: Real science says if there was something there already it must fit with the evidence of what we know.
Real science says there was nothing and, when you sum everything up, there is still nothing. Zero total energy!
(July 25, 2022 at 10:02 pm)Billy Bob Wrote: It must be observable, repeatable, and falsifiable.
It is. Sadly, we are inside the Universe and cannot observe the absence of a Universe in order to determine the conditions that lead to the formation of a Universe.
(July 25, 2022 at 10:02 pm)Billy Bob Wrote: We know the 1LT says there's a conservation of energy.
Exactly what "Real Science" claims.
Here, I'll help:
https://lmgtfy.app/?q=total+energy+of+the+universe
(July 25, 2022 at 10:02 pm)Billy Bob Wrote: It can change forms and neither can be created or destroyed.
Change forms.... you're on to something...
(July 25, 2022 at 10:02 pm)Billy Bob Wrote: Creation cannot happen by natural means.
Define "Natural means".
Are you wanting to run into the "Argument from Ignorance" fallacy?
(July 25, 2022 at 10:02 pm)Billy Bob Wrote: The 2LT has various aspects, one being the universe is winding down, entropy.
That is valid for normal matter and energy, but you're not taking into account dark matter and negative energy, are you?
(July 25, 2022 at 10:02 pm)Billy Bob Wrote: Usable energy is becoming less usable, so at one point usable energy was at its max.
Usable by what?
The maximum total energy in the Universe was ZERO and the total energy of the Universe is still ZERO.
(July 25, 2022 at 10:02 pm)Billy Bob Wrote: This (the 1LT and 2LT) all points to a supernatural creation, by a supernatural creator at a certain point in which matter, space and time were created.
As seen above, no. There is no need for anything unnatural.
Space-time can have always existed and the singularity can have been a particularly excessive random event in the whole quantum fluctuations thing (I'm aware that you never actually followed through on Krauss' points, but you should. While not conclusive, they do hint at possibilities)
(July 25, 2022 at 10:02 pm)Billy Bob Wrote: When I read how it can happen otherwise, ALL the doubters resort to science-fiction.
As if the supernatural hypothesis is anything but fiction...
Tell me, how did you (or anyone) first arrive at the notion of the supernatural entity?
(July 25, 2022 at 10:02 pm)Billy Bob Wrote: Once a supernatural creation is accepted, then the next step is finding proof of what supernatural power did it. We know these laws and have NO doubts about them.
Why must such a "supernatural creation" be accepted? Either that hypothesis stands on its own merit, or it gets shoved in the drawer until evidence comes to light that supports it.
Thus far, there is a very poor track record for the god hypothesis as an explainer of things, so the will to accept it on this one thing is very low. And, as you may have seen above, we don't really need it.
Either way, science is our best tool to find out what really happened. Let it work, don't shunt it with an unrealistic hypothesis.
So where does it add up to zero? Zero in this context is nothing. Nothing as in NO thing, no matter, space, and time. Give me the science that is observable, repeatable, and falsifiable. Show me your zero has no space, matter, and time. Oh, that would be impossible. You believe in the impossible. You believe in making up whatever you want. Your ASS-trophysics also claim that about 68% of the universe is dark energy, it's NEVER been found. They HAD to make that up to 'answer' for their insanity. Sure, they provide more laughs with dark matter making up about 27%.
So, do show how there was no space, matter, and time and that it did something when there was nothing to do something. Actually try thinking before you right such absurdity.
Go on, it's YOUR position so back it up. I'm calling your bluff so show your hand.