How did I miss this bit of comedy gold?
I've seen the curvature of the horizon with my own two eyes on high altitude flights.
I used a pair of modest binoculars actually. A telescope would have been overkill with a limited field of view. I did this because I couldn't figure out why a pair of smokestacks had suddenly materialized in the middle of the ocean. Only after the rest of the ship started to come up over the horizon did I understand what I was looking at. Waves are only a problem if you are near water level. I happened to be standing on top of a small cliff, ~ 10 m, so the distance to any wave tops impinging on my view of the horizon was a very long way out. Additionally, invoking waves gives you a wavy images. Peaks should obscure more of the ship one moment while troughs should reveal more in the next. The transition that I observed was smooth. Also, there was way too much ship below the horizon to hide with anything short of a tsunami.
8 inches?!? Either your observers are smurfs or you're trying to take some very strange dick pics.
Yup. Unless it's lined up perfectly with the Earth's shadow you'll have no problem. Ever notice how you only ever get lunar eclipses on full moon nights?
Trivially falsified by basic observation. The sun's size and sunset simply don't work in this model.
On the equator, the sun at high noon on the equinox would be larger than the same sun seen at the same time further north or south. 30% smaller at 5000 miles from the equator. Worse, the sun will start the day small, grow larger toward noon as it gets progressively closer, then dwindle toward nightfall. This is why we assume that the sun is very distant. Because the observation that the sun is always the same angular size is only consistent with a very distant sun.
Worse, the sun never sets on a flat world. It either remains visible, winks out half way to the horizon, or dwindles to a dawn-dusk haze. The answer depends on the variant of wrong that you're playing with but doesn't make it any less wrong. To get the sun to within just 10 degrees of the horizon it needs to be 5000 miles / tan 10 degrees = 28,356 miles away laterally. Oh, and the sun will rise faster the closer it gets to the zenith and then set progressively slower the closer it gets toward the horizon. But never reach it.
These observations pretty thoroughly and simply falsify the flat Earth model. You can improve the angular size variation by moving the sun to higher altitude, but that makes sunrise/sunset even more ridiculous. Or you can try and resolve sunrise by moving the sun closer but that parbroils Kenya at noon while simultaneously glaciating New York.
(July 19, 2022 at 10:59 am)h311inac311 Wrote: Premis: We don't know what shape Earth actually is.
Persuade me, do you know the shape of this realm?
I've seen the curvature of the horizon with my own two eyes on high altitude flights.
(July 26, 2022 at 7:51 am)h311inac311 Wrote: Have you ever used a telescope to bring that ship back into view? Plenty of people have and they've caught it on video. Let's make one thing clear however, some of the bottom of the ship (or in this case the city) will be obscured by the waves.
I used a pair of modest binoculars actually. A telescope would have been overkill with a limited field of view. I did this because I couldn't figure out why a pair of smokestacks had suddenly materialized in the middle of the ocean. Only after the rest of the ship started to come up over the horizon did I understand what I was looking at. Waves are only a problem if you are near water level. I happened to be standing on top of a small cliff, ~ 10 m, so the distance to any wave tops impinging on my view of the horizon was a very long way out. Additionally, invoking waves gives you a wavy images. Peaks should obscure more of the ship one moment while troughs should reveal more in the next. The transition that I observed was smooth. Also, there was way too much ship below the horizon to hide with anything short of a tsunami.
Quote:If we use Earth's curvature calculation (8in * (Number of Miles) Squared) we can see that (60^2) * 8 inches = 28,800 / 12 = 2,400 Feet.
8 inches?!? Either your observers are smurfs or you're trying to take some very strange dick pics.
Quote:Also, quick question, have any one of you ever observed a full moon at midnight?
Yup. Unless it's lined up perfectly with the Earth's shadow you'll have no problem. Ever notice how you only ever get lunar eclipses on full moon nights?
Quote:The sun is much smaller and much closer to Earth than in your model.
Imagine a Dinner-plate with the center as the magnetic North pole, now imagine a glowing airplane about 5,000 mile up that constantly travels west ward, spiraling either upwards or downwards in-between the tropics.
The light from the Sun is localized (as you can see in high-altitude footage) obscured by both air particles as well as our perspective.
Trivially falsified by basic observation. The sun's size and sunset simply don't work in this model.
On the equator, the sun at high noon on the equinox would be larger than the same sun seen at the same time further north or south. 30% smaller at 5000 miles from the equator. Worse, the sun will start the day small, grow larger toward noon as it gets progressively closer, then dwindle toward nightfall. This is why we assume that the sun is very distant. Because the observation that the sun is always the same angular size is only consistent with a very distant sun.
Worse, the sun never sets on a flat world. It either remains visible, winks out half way to the horizon, or dwindles to a dawn-dusk haze. The answer depends on the variant of wrong that you're playing with but doesn't make it any less wrong. To get the sun to within just 10 degrees of the horizon it needs to be 5000 miles / tan 10 degrees = 28,356 miles away laterally. Oh, and the sun will rise faster the closer it gets to the zenith and then set progressively slower the closer it gets toward the horizon. But never reach it.
These observations pretty thoroughly and simply falsify the flat Earth model. You can improve the angular size variation by moving the sun to higher altitude, but that makes sunrise/sunset even more ridiculous. Or you can try and resolve sunrise by moving the sun closer but that parbroils Kenya at noon while simultaneously glaciating New York.
