Russia and Ukraine

[The Architect Of Fate]

This is a handy guide to the kinds of statements that make up the Actual Anti War Stance (because being against Russia's invasion is the Anti War Stance)

We could use the list to play Bingo on this thread.

Fixed the statement above. Also, it's rich to criticize other people on this thread when you are the coward who blocks everyone 

1. We don't want war, we are only defending ourselves! 

Yup because that is reality. One side invading. One side is defending. Kind of elementary as Ukraine has not invaded Russia. In fact, no one has invaded Russia. This isn't propaganda it's a fact. 

2. Our adversary is solely responsible for this war!

Russia launched an invasion of Ukraine and nothing anyone else did justifies that. Russia created the astroturf separatist movements and funded them. So no matter how you look at it Russia started the war. Also, NATO can take in any members it wants and any nation should be allowed to join NATO if they want to. None of that Justifies an invasion. This isn't propaganda it's a fact. 

 

3. Our adversary's leader is inherently evil and resembles the devil

Putin is a demonstrable, Murderer, Liar, and Thug. His popularity is built solely on his iron grip on the media and his willingness to dispose of his critics. This isn't propaganda it's a fact. 

https://www.rferl.org/a/putin-journalist...10359.html

4. We are defending a noble cause, not our particular interests!

No one arguing that. A stable free Ukraine is very much in Western interests as is curtailing Russian aggression in Europe. There is self-interest in punishing Russia for its actions by handing them a loss in Ukraine as it will hopefully move it away from such belligerent actions in the future.This isn't propaganda it's a fact. 

5. The enemy is purposefully committing atrocities; if we are making mistakes this happens without intention

By their own admission, they purposefully commit atrocities. And no one is saying Ukraine has been perfect in the war. No war is 100% clean in war. But the contrast between Russia's actions and Ukraine's actions is stark. And trying to pretend there has been equivalence is simply nonsense. This isn't propaganda it's a fact. 

6. The enemy makes use of illegal weapons

They do. Russia has used Cluster Munitions and  Thermobaric weapons both are illegal under international laws. This is not propaganda it's a fact. 

7. We suffer few losses, the enemy's losses are considerable

No one arguing this. Ukraine's losses have been bad. But Russia's losses have been truly horrific. This isn't propaganda it's a simple statistical fact.

8. Recognized intellectuals and artists support our cause

That's your side's argument. You won't shut up about this expert or that expert supporting your position. Though most of the time their fringe opinions with clear biases or links to the Putin regime or like ironically you trying to take a list and force reality to fit it. Despite it not actually fitting what's actually going on.

9. Our cause is sacred

No one here is saying it is sacred. Russia by contrast puts all kinds of Religious hookum on this invasion.

10. Whoever casts doubt on our propaganda helps the enemy and is a traitor

Considering just about every person you trot out in this thread either has links to Russia or consistent Russian sympathies. This holds true. Thus is not propaganda. 

long version:

The long version is just as much nonsense as the short version only it uses more words to convey the nonsense. Sometimes it's not propaganda. Sometimes it's really how things are. Some times evil people start shit and you are within your rights to kick their ass.