(December 16, 2011 at 4:43 am)Cthulhu Dreaming Wrote: For the record, I *do* help people in need, voluntarily out of my own pocket.
Nice. So do I. Voluntarily. It's the forced that irks me.
Quote: For someone in that situation, taking away $900 in income annually is the difference between being able to feed your family or not. We're talking about someone who is doing the best that they can under the circumstances, in a state with one of the worst unemployment rates in the country.
I do believe there is a generous food stamp program in every state. Just making a stab here but I'd guess she probably receives about $300-$400 a month in food stamps. That $75 a month won't cause the devastation you speak of to their food supply. I'd also ask about any housing assistance received.
Before you ask, it gets paid for out of everyones 10%.
Quote:I used to feel as you appear to do. With my cozy middle-class upbringing, I hadn't been exposed to working-class poverty, and it was pretty easy for me to believe that the poor were that way because they were lazy. Clearly, I no longer hold that position.
I appear to hold that position? The poor are lazy? Did I not state my income? Did I ever tell you about my upbringing?

A long, long way from 'cozy middle-class'. No sir. I do not hold the position that all poor people are lazy.
Quote:It would be nice if we lived in a world where every person who was willing and able to work had full employment, and could "pull their own weight". Where disability, mental illness, and lack of education and opportunity didn't exist. Where people didn't abandon their spouse and kids to poverty. Where the greedy didn't prey upon the less fortunate to line their own pockets.
This is just an attempt to grab at the heart-strings. Nice try, but as you can see I have none.
Quote:.... tax credits to the working poor. I have no problem with this. Clearly, you disagree, and that's your right.
I am a 'working poor'. I get no such credits. My tax form is "What did you earn?" "No wife and kids? Goto line XX." "Here's the tax amount on what you earn" And it is usually approx. 10%.
After taxes I net approx. 22,500. How far away is that from what you said your friend earns? I believe you said 19,000. $3500. OH BOY!! She made $3500 less than me yet we give her a check for $4000?!
Quote:...if I'm going to bitch and moan about taxes,... It's certainly not going to be because we redistribute a small amount of income to those in need.
You just demonstrated we 'redistribute' that small amount to where your friend now nets more than I do because of her choice to breed. Nets a tremendous amount when counting the food stamps and other assistance she may recieve from which I am obliged to contribute to.
I am a working poor. Buy your argument should I not be receiving at least 1/3 of that amount also? 3 people in her household, $4000. One in mine, $1333.33. O.K. cool, if they cut me a check every year for that amount I'll quit bitching.

Quote:We (I assume you also live in the USA) live in a country that has historically enjoyed tremendous prosperity - and in my view, it's shameful that in such a country, we have such widespread poverty and need still exists.
Agreed.
Quote:I'm all for simplifying our tax code - but not at the expense of those in need.
Agreed. Although I believe our definitions of "those in need" may differ widely.
I used to tell a lot of religious jokes. Not any more, I'm a registered sects offender.
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...the least christian thing a person can do is to become a christian. ~Chuck
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NO MA'AM
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...the least christian thing a person can do is to become a christian. ~Chuck
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NO MA'AM
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