Why Agnostic?

[Kyuuketsuki]

Imagine you are in a closed in room with no access to the outside. There are no windows to see outside, no other technical devices you could use to see outside, etc. ...

This is not about something that is empirically measurable, it is about belief and, as such, we are in a very different ball game ... we are still in a two state scenario i.e. you cannot "not know" whether you believe a given claim or not, you either do or you don't. IOW your given scenario is irrelevant to the question at hand ... I suppose I could (but won't since I don't greatly care) even argue that your use of it constituted a strawman.

I simply cannot see how it is a dodge. Your beliefs tell you nothing about hor provable you think something is, just as how provable you think something is tells you nothing about what you believe. Perhaps you could explain what "dodge" you think they are doing, because you've just stated that without any reasoning.

You cannot see how it's a dodge? What the hell do you want me to do about that?

Accepting for a moment your point that it is possible to view the existence of deity as unknown and unknowable this still leaves us with a person who is either atheist or theist and give that the claim that a deity is unknown or unknowable (one I don't agree with since I see no reason to accept ANY claim that something has no empirical attributes) proves absolutely [expletive deleted] we are left with it being nothing more than a philosophical dodge i.e. the theist or atheist that would like to believe there remains the possibility of such a being yet cannot support it in any way empirically has no choice but to retreat into the psychobabble of modern day philosophy.

Hope that helps.

Not really! Quite simply this explains why I regard the entire idea of agnosticism as wishy-washy rubbish ... it is also the reason (since you evidently do believe it is a valid POV) why I didn't want to continue arguing this with you, why I thought we were done ... we are on different planes, we don't see things the same way indeed in some ways I feel you are closer to Frodo's POV than mine.

Kyu