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Please present positive arguments why you think atheism is true
RE: Please present positive arguments why you think atheism is true
(April 24, 2012 at 12:05 pm)Jireh Wrote: It seens you did not understand my point. Can you proof nature is all there is ?

I don't need to. That's irrelevant. What is relevant, is what is reasonable to derive truth about reality..

(April 24, 2012 at 12:05 pm)Jireh Wrote: according to wiki :

Naturalism commonly refers to the viewpoint that laws of nature (as opposed to supernatural ones) operate in the universe, and that nothing exists beyond the natural universe or, if it does, it does not affect the natural universe.

i was referring to that viewpoint.

The viewpoint of "read the first line" and ignore the ENTIRE ARTICLE.

Nice one. Whooooooooooooooosh.

(April 24, 2012 at 10:02 am)Jireh Wrote: nothing means the absence of any thing. Therefore, it has no potentialities.
Whatelse needs to be defined about what nothing means ?

Because science has never proposed your nothing exists, and in fact, argue that it is unlikely to exist by definition.

(April 24, 2012 at 12:05 pm)Jireh Wrote:
NoMoreFaith Wrote:Your argument presupposes the existence of time prior to the existence of this universe in order for an eternal God to "decide" to create the universe from his metaphysical realm.

No. Time did not exist beyond the universe.

In which case, God cannot choose an "instant" to create the universe. The universe is either as eternal as God(rendering KCA illegitimate), or God does not exist (rendering KCA illegitimate).

The creation of an instant, creates the concept of time, by attributing BEFORE UNIVERSE, and AFTER UNIVERSE.

You cannot create a universe without a period of "no universe". That period means there is a separate measure of time otherwise the concept of creation cannot exist.

EDIT: Let's simplify; You say that it is impossible for eternity to compose of finite points. Point 1 is before universe, Point 2 is after universe. With 2 points you can break it down to 1.5 (halfway to point 2). By definition of creation of a finite point, you refute your claim that eternity cannot compose of finite points if you assert that God is still eternal.

Quote:God's bringing about the universe is the total and direct dependence of the contingent universe on the divine will. Such a relation of dependence does not require that God be located in time. Thus, divine timeless action is not incoherent.

In which case, eternity is not impossible, which renders KCA illegitimate.
Time did not exist until the expansion of the singularity, so divine action is made irrelevant, or rather unnecessary to the creation of the universe.

I find it telling that you are resorting to merely copy pasting websites that agree with your point of view.

Out of your depth much?
Self-authenticating private evidence is useless, because it is indistinguishable from the illusion of it. ― Kel, Kelosophy Blog

If you’re going to watch tele, you should watch Scooby Doo. That show was so cool because every time there’s a church with a ghoul, or a ghost in a school. They looked beneath the mask and what was inside?
The f**king janitor or the dude who runs the waterslide. Throughout history every mystery. Ever solved has turned out to be. Not Magic.
― Tim Minchin, Storm
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Messages In This Thread
RE: Please present positive arguments why you think atheism is true - by NoMoreFaith - April 24, 2012 at 12:20 pm

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