(May 22, 2012 at 12:00 pm)Alter2Ego Wrote: ALTER2EGO -to- EVERYONE:The Jews Believe Hell or Sheol to be death/the Grave. They do not believe in a place of eternal torment. So all of you OT quotes would logically point to hell being the grave or pit.
The teaching of hellfire is commonplace in Christendom and non-Christian religions. This teaching defames the Creator and portrays him as a sadist who tortures people in flames of fire for all eternity—as punishment for wrongdoing committed during the relatively brief human lifespan. The hellfire dogma was brought into Christianity by the Roman Catholics who copied it from pagan religions. (Pagans are those who do not worship the God of the Judeo-Christian Bible.)
The Bible makes it clear as to how God views the ritual burning of people. Jehovah ended up rejecting the ancient Israelites after they got involved with pagan worship, which included burning their children to death.
"And they [the Israelites/sons of Judah] have built the high places of Topheth, which is in the valley of the son of Hinnom, in order to burn their sons and their daughters in the fire, a thing that I had not commanded and that HAD NOT COME UP INTO MY HEART." (Jeremiah 7:31)
"{58} And they kept offending him with their high places, and with their graven images they kept inciting him to jealousy. {59} God heard and got to be furious, and he condemned Israel very much. {60} And he finally forsook the tabernacle of Shiloh, the tent in which he resided among earthling men."
(Psalms 78:58-60)
The scriptures indicate that hell is nothing more than mankind’s common grave. Proof of this is provided by a verse of scripture in the Bible, which no hellfire-believing Christian can explain away. I’m referring to the scripture that says Jesus Christ--the epitome of a perfect, sinless, and obedient man--died and went to hell.
"{21} In fact, to this course you were called, because even Christ suffered for you, leaving you a model for you to follow his steps closely. {22} He committed no sin, nor was deception found in his mouth." (1 Peter 2:21-22)
"He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that HIS SOUL WAS NOT LEFT IN HELL, neither his flesh did see corruption."
(Acts 2:31--King James Version)
NOTE #1: The Bible uses the word "fire" symbolically to indicate cleansing OR permanent death OR permanent destruction. In the few times when the Bible used the word "fire" literally, it was with reference to events such as the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah--at which point, the individuals did not suffer eternal torment, they died immediately.
NOTE #2: the words "Hell" and "Hades" and "Sheol" and "Pit" are synonyms that mean THE GRAVE (of mankind).
NOTE #3: In the Bible, the expression "the lake of fire" and the word "Gehenna" are figurative or symbolic language that refer to permanent death or permanent destruction.
NOTE #4: "High Places" as used in the scriptures that I quote in this thread refer to the worship of the false gods.
DISCUSSION QUESTIONS:
1. According to Jeremiah 7:31, did Jehovah command the ancient Israelites to burn anyone in the fire?
2. According to Jeremiah 7:31, did the burning of people come to God's heart?
3. According to Jeremiah 7:31 and Psalms 78:58-59, did the ancient Israelites offend God by getting involved with false worship in their "high places", which included burning people to death?
4. According to those who teach hellfire torment, hell is a place for people who are wicked and sinful. If Hellfire is for wicked people, why did Jesus spend three days in hell--considering that it says at 1 Peter 2:22 that he did not commit any sin?
5. Jesus obeyed Jehovah and died a slow and torturous death for mankind. Hadn't he suffered enough? He'd suffered terribly--because of being obedient to his Heavenly Father. So why was he being punished again with burning hellfire? What's the logic for punishing him all over again?
6. Recall that after Jesus' resurrection, he appeared and spoke to several of his faithful apostles on different occasions before he returned to heaven. Why is it that Jesus made no mention to any of his apostles--after his resurrection--that he went to hell where he burned for three days?
7. When people are being tortured in hellfire, wouldn't they have to KNOW or be conscious/aware of the fact that they are being burned? I mean to say, what's the point of punishing people in hell if they aren't even aware?
8. Those who believe in eternal torment say that the person's soul is being burned forever. What is the soul? Is it something separate from the person's body? Are animals souls also or is this only for humans?
Some do not believe in the resurection either. you get this life and that is it.
that said Christ had another take on Hell not consistent with traditional Jewish beliefs. (Matthew 25:41), “unquenchable fire” (Matthew 3:12), “shame and everlasting contempt” (Daniel 12:2), a place where “the fire is not quenched” (Mark 9:44-49), a place of “torment” and “fire” (Luke 16:23-24), “everlasting destruction” (2 Thessalonians 1:9), a place where “the smoke of torment rises forever and ever” (Revelation 14:10-11), and a “lake of burning sulfur” where the wicked are “tormented day and night forever and ever” (Revelation 20:10).
I used to be a burn in hell forever type of person but now i am not so sure, even so I know Hell is real and whatever the actual make up of it, it will not be a pleasent place, no matter how long you spend there.
