(September 3, 2012 at 3:19 pm)idunno Wrote:(September 3, 2012 at 3:13 pm)IATIA Wrote: This is an ambiguous statement. Just because this "all-knowing god" 'knows' what choice may be made, in no way forces the choice any more than I force you to drive on the right side of the road rather that cross the median into oncoming traffic.
In effect, this "all-knowing god" implies 'Laplace's demon', which would negate any free will, including god's.
I think we're in agreement. I don't hold that foreknowledge removes free will.
Scratch that. Your two statements appeared contradictory. I'm arguing against the notion that omniscience removes the possibility to do otherwise and therefore removes free will.
Not really. There are certain 'cause and effect' relationships that can allow one to 'know' what will happen. In the case of 'free will', knowing what happens does not force the choice anymore that knowing of the existence of gravity forces an apple to hit the ground.
However, for this "all-knowing god" to 'know' what choice I will make, requires more than simple cause and effect. This "all-knowing god" must know everything about all the particles that lead to the chemical reaction that will determine my ultimate decision to choose either the apple or the orange. Again, this 'knowledge implies 'Laplace's demon' which negates any 'free will' because the domino effect of the cause and effect of all the particles that ultimately lead to my decision is predictable, knowable and not chaotic or random.
You make people miserable and there's nothing they can do about it, just like god.
-- Homer Simpson
God has no place within these walls, just as facts have no place within organized religion.
-- Superintendent Chalmers
Science is like a blabbermouth who ruins a movie by telling you how it ends. There are some things we don't want to know. Important things.
-- Ned Flanders
Once something's been approved by the government, it's no longer immoral.
-- The Rev Lovejoy
-- Homer Simpson
God has no place within these walls, just as facts have no place within organized religion.
-- Superintendent Chalmers
Science is like a blabbermouth who ruins a movie by telling you how it ends. There are some things we don't want to know. Important things.
-- Ned Flanders
Once something's been approved by the government, it's no longer immoral.
-- The Rev Lovejoy
