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OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God.
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God.
(September 21, 2012 at 2:01 am)Pokemon Wrote: It seems to me that if one wishes to believe something, then it makes this thing much easier to believe however if one rejects the possibly of the [non] belief without consideration of the [lack of] evidence then one is hard-pressed to accept any evidence that contradicts his own preconceived notions.
Disregarding all preconcieved notions we can[not] deductively prove God without Appealing to Biblical authority. Of course the analysis is required but truely if a thiest abandons reason simply because that reason no longer supports reason then perhaps he ought to reconsider his worldview because I happen to know plenty of pseudo scientists who abandon reason to fit their nee ds: Young Earth Creationists.
I think my only slightly altered version of the quote is much more accurate. We aren't in denial, you (maybe) are. Bolding mine, all underlined segments are also mine and not part of the original quote.

pokemon Wrote:1. (x) (Bx -> Cx)
2. Bu
3. Cu

Where B = begins to exist; c = cause, u = universe.
Premise one
Everything that begins to exist has a cause
Premise Two
The Universe began to exist
Therefore,
The Universe has a cause.
Regarding premise 1:
It seems rather intuitive. It is confirmed by virtually every area of our sense experience. It is a axiom at best.Even quantum fluctuations, which many suppose to be uncaused, are causally conditioned in that they depend on the existence of a pre-existing quantum vacuum.
Yet god is exempt from having a cause. Why? He's just that awesome, don't question it! We don't need to conform to standard rules of logic!

pokemon Wrote:Regarding Premise two:
"An actual infinite cannot exist.
An infinite temporal regress of events is an actual infinite.
Therefore an infinite temporal regress of events cannot exist" WLC
If the Universe was infinite along with being temporal because it relates to causes within time, which likewise always existed, then is an infinite temporal regress because it goes into the past forever. The universe must be explained this way in order to avoid an absolute cosmic beginning to all of space-time reality. It requires there exist an actual infinite within natural reality, because past causes and events have to go on forever into the past by definition given an eternal universe. This perennial philosophical problem is not an issue under theistic accounts which produce arguments for transcendent being like a personal God because traditionally God is considered the only non-contingent or always existing, non-caused cause. The infinite regress is stopped by an ontological commitment to a supernatural personal agent that is the ultimate cause of the existence, and according to the kalam cosmological argument, the beginning of the universe. Wink Shades

Bolding mine. Do you know what omnipotent means? God's power is an infinity. Likewise, I've read arguments claiming that entropy would have caused the universe to reach equilibrium had it been eternal. However, I doubt that entropy would have had much effect on the singularity, so if we take the 'beginning' of the universe as after the singularity, then the universe has a finite age, if not it may or may not be eternal.
John Adams Wrote:The Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion.
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Messages In This Thread
OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Puddleglum - September 18, 2012 at 7:38 am
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Drich - September 18, 2012 at 9:24 am
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Drich - September 18, 2012 at 9:08 pm
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Drich - September 18, 2012 at 10:08 pm
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by TaraJo - September 19, 2012 at 10:59 am
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Drich - September 19, 2012 at 11:39 am
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by TaraJo - September 19, 2012 at 4:36 pm
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Drich - September 19, 2012 at 11:31 pm
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Drich - September 20, 2012 at 10:08 am
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Drich - September 20, 2012 at 11:00 am
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by TaraJo - September 20, 2012 at 11:04 am
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by TaraJo - September 20, 2012 at 12:28 am
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Drich - September 20, 2012 at 11:28 am
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Drich - September 20, 2012 at 12:38 pm
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Drich - September 20, 2012 at 2:59 pm
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Drich - September 20, 2012 at 6:24 pm
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Drich - September 20, 2012 at 8:08 pm
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Cinjin - September 18, 2012 at 10:18 am
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by TaraJo - September 18, 2012 at 10:08 am
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by TaraJo - September 18, 2012 at 10:33 am
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Cato - September 27, 2012 at 6:21 pm
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Drich - September 18, 2012 at 9:51 pm
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Phish - September 18, 2012 at 2:08 pm
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Drich - September 19, 2012 at 12:27 am
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Drich - September 19, 2012 at 8:26 am
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Polaris - September 18, 2012 at 11:27 pm
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Drich - September 19, 2012 at 7:52 am
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Polaris - September 18, 2012 at 11:53 pm
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Drich - September 20, 2012 at 8:09 pm
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Drich - September 20, 2012 at 8:11 pm
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Drich - September 20, 2012 at 10:16 pm
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Drich - September 20, 2012 at 10:19 pm
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Waratah - September 20, 2012 at 10:15 pm
RE: OK Christians. your chance. Convince me of God. - by Darkstar - September 21, 2012 at 9:50 pm

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