RE: what being apart from the law means.
February 22, 2013 at 11:53 pm
(This post was last modified: February 23, 2013 at 12:00 am by Ryantology.)
(February 22, 2013 at 10:39 pm)Drich Wrote: what are you talking about? We were created perfectly and lived in God's will in his presents, until we chose to separate ourselves from Him.
"We"? I seem to remember it being two people, two people of childlike intellect who were easily tricked into disobeying God a single time by succumbing to temptation God intentionally placed in front of Adam for the express purpose of testing him. That sounds like a terribly flawed creation to me, to say nothing of the worst sort of disproportionate retribution.
Quote:Sin=Choice. We were give the opportunity for choice from the beginning. Even before we knew what sin was we had opportunity for choice (tree of knowledge represented that original choice.). Even so the simple act of choosing separates us from God. (As per the consequences of eating from that tree proved)
That is a separation of God only because God chooses to see it that way, and because he has to act like a spiteful fucker over the slightest possible transgression.
Sin does not equal choice. If God was to offer a choice, a true choice, he would have accepted that choice, whatever it was. He did not offer the Tree as a choice, nor did he indicate to Adam that he was free to take from it and eat if he wanted to. He was ordered never to touch it. That is not a choice, that is a demand.
You wish to consider sin a choice because that takes the responsibility away from God and places it on Adam. Except, Adam could not have been expected to know what would have happened. All that God says to him is that he would 'surely die', to a guy who has absolutely no idea what death is. God said nothing about banishing him, making him live in want and pain. So even if it was a choice, it was an unfair one.
God's choice is like an armed robber pointing a pistol at the store clerk's face and giving him the 'choice' to hand over all the money or die.
Quote:As with the garden, We have been given choice so that we may choose to be with God. But, like I said the simple act of choosing nullifies the choice we make to be with God.
Enter atonement. Now we have the ability to live outside of the rules of "tot-ism" and can still obtain the righteousness needed to spend eternity with the one we choose to be with.
Why didn't God choose not to let people atone for thousands of years? Everything about this being is arbitrary.
Again, we are supposed to 'atone' for things that are only sins because God arbitrarily decided they should be. There is nothing of less value than an arbitrary rule. It is not about being good or righteous. It is about doing as you are told. It is about being a mindless, heartless sheep. God gave us choice, but any attempt to use it results in punishment. Totally malicious.
Quote:Being separated for the law means we are separated from the law as our only way to obtain righteousness. Separated meaning Christ made it impossible for anyone to follow the law and be found righteous before God.
So, God made a mistake that Christ fixed?
Quote:The only way to find the righteousness/atonement Christ offers is to love your Lord God with all of your heart, mind, spirit, and strength. To love your enemies as yourself (which includes forgiving those who have sinned against you, as you have sinned against God.) and to be faithful to what you have been given. This is what it means to accept Christ as your savior.
You should take the time you waste here trying to rationalize the insanity you believe and use it to love God. I think he might wonder what the hell you're doing.
(February 22, 2013 at 7:54 pm)Rhythm Wrote: ...and whatever answer he offers will be convenient and in-line with whatever his religious point of view happens to be at the moment, which is to be expected, and which will get you no-where with regards to the issue addressed.
Rhythm is a more accurate prophet than any found in the Bible.