The concept of Hell discourages belief

[Drich]

I've heard it said that nothing is too hard for God. Do you disagree? Do you believe in a God that can't decree perpetual separation between two groups of people for eternity and just have it be so without checking every 5 minutes to make sure it's still working?

It's not about viable options. It about the reason He should make an effort to support those who Do not want anything to do with Him or is people.

Imagine a house guest who wants nothing to do with you staying in your home for an eternity...

Now Imagine a guest who has killed raped murdered and persucuted members of your family. Why would you even want them in your sight?

Again we are not talking about just the luke warm believers who can't be bother to fully commit or those of you who demand God grovel before you on your term before the commit to belief. You all are a small minority compared to those who outright Hate God and his followers. Are those people to be mixed in with the rest of you or are they to be sent to Hell? What about satan and his angels? Are they to be mixed in with you? What if they start Raping and causing harm to you and people like you For eternity, is this fair? This walled city you are suggesting has the potential to be worse than Hell for everyone there.

Infinite punishment for finite crimes is unjust by definition.

That's the thing because you are finite does not mean the sin was. No one can deny that what happened on 911 changed the direction America was going, Forever. We do not know what person could have been wiped out of existence because one or both of their parents died that day. He/She could have been a Hitler or an Enistein, or a Great world leader. There is no telling what would have been. Not to mention the effects destroying the World center of finance has had on our global ecconmy. This is what the butterfly effect does on a large scale. Even Our indivisual actions have consenquences that can change the direction and development of man. The point is we do not know what our sins spawn, so we can't say our sins are finite.

There has to come a point where you've suffered enough, no matter what you've done. What crime is so great that you deserve to be tortured eternally after you've already been tortured for a trillion trillion trillion years?

Do you really think your mind was designed to take so much punishment and stay where it is now? (To retain your personality your being/What makes you, you?) No. Even if your being was not consumed by the void your mind would only be able to endure so much before what makes you, you is gone. I know my experience in Hell was nothing more than a dream, but I felt my mind going the deeper I fell into the void. I came to the understanding that my sanity was apart of creation and as the doors of creation closed on the pit I was in, the controled I enjoyed over my ablities to think and reason began to leave me.

I Think, the worse we are the longer we are made to endure Hell. I was just a unproductive branch and as a result burned up quickly, leaving a ball of primal emotions that could not think or reason. I also think that For a hitler or a Stalin, there experience of Hell will be more involved before the are consumed. Satan however is going to be in it for the long haul.

To each their own, but I don't see any reason to believe you.

As you said to each their own. If you are looking to be more 'moral' than God, then there is nothing that can be said or done. If however you want to look a little deeper than the medevil church's understanding of Hell then I will be glad to help you find the places in scripture that describes Hell as a CONSUMING fire. And that Hell is eternal For the punishment of Satan..

Maybe, but your isn't, either. The Bible never mentions the void you mention or hell being separation from God.

Maybe ask what I am talking about or ask for Book Chapter and verse before you assume.
Christ calls it a "Great Chasm" In Luke 16:19-31 in the story about Lazarus and the rich man.

In Rev 9:1-11 John refers to it as the great abyss or in some translations the bottomless pit.

and again in Rev 20 it mentions this abyss or void or even gulf in some translations The orginal Greek word is: ἄβυσσος abyssos
1) bottomless

2) unbounded

3) the abyss

a) the pit

b) the immeasurable depth

c) of Orcus, a very deep gulf or chasm in the lowest parts of the earth used as the common receptacle of the dead and especially as the abode of demons
http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexi...=G12&t=KJV

After it's no longer useful in determining our fates. Would that be okay in this life, say, witholding information about which cancer treatment is most effective until after the patient has committed to a course of treatment?

You and I see things differently. You see cancer as an always evil thing. I see cancer as a tool, one than can proof or even establish a relationship with God or show you you dont or never really had one. My end goal is not about how long I can enjoy this life, it is about ensuring we get to enjoy eternity, and if enduring a second rate cancer treatment is the only way this can happen then so be it. If it means a stroke or heart attack, contracting AIDS or some other really terriable thing to me or someone close to me then again so be it. This life this world is not our home, so why fuss over it so much when there is so much more to be had?

You can truly love whatever your torturer wants if the pain is bad enough and has going on long enough.

If you think this then you do not understand what love is. Or rather do not understand what God wants from us.

Self preservation isn't an issue, apparently not existing forever isn't an option. I don't love him in this life because I think he is imaginary. If he wants me to love him once I know he's real and he's insecure about whether I would love him if I wasn't being tortured, maybe he shouldn't torture me.

Which is not an excuse as we have been given the oppertunity to have God personally interact with us to proove to us that He is absolutly real. All we have to do is earnestly want to set aside our pride and follow his instructions.

Perhaps you could quote the verse that refers to hell as 'The Void'?

See above

Due to my familiarity with agonizing pain, I would have to conclude that hell must not actually be very painful, then.

Again it is all a matter of perspective. I found Hell to be empty, and I brought the torment with me, because for the breifest of moments I felt the love and saw What God was actually offering me. I can only imagine not everyone will care as much as I did. Which is what leads me to believe that I was consumed by 'hell fire' on the way through the gates, and why I think others maybe there a while before they are consumed.

Could you define God's limits, please? You seem to think you have special information that God can't build an unbreachable wall. I need a scorecord to keep track of all the things you think God can't do.

He did infact build an unbreachable wall Luke talks about it in luke 16. What makes it unbreachable is the fact that Hell in on the otherside.
As Far as the limits of God are concerned, it seems that He limits Himself to not reprogram the minds of who He has created. Lucifer and His followers along with all of those in whom He had killed verify this.

I'm not privy to the inner workings of the heaven of your imagination.

http://www.biblegateway.com/
You are now

Can the full power and authority of the Holy Spirit at your beck and call help you construct an argument for the existence of God that doesn't contain a logical fallacy?

The bible tells us God Himself establishes himself in the life of the believer, if that person simply humbles himself before God. Why would He help me bypass His own decree?
The Full power and authority of God is for you to experience yourself. Not for me to water down for you to comperhend.

Because a person who claims to have the power of God at their disposal who can't do anything anyone else can't do too sounds more like a schizophrenic than someone who has been granted access to any ultimate truths.

Then you do not understand the most basic nature of God. We have been given access to the Holy Spirit so that magic may abound, and we get to do things the way we want. In the Lord's prayer we are taught to seek God's will over our own. Meaning the Power of the Holy Spirit that has been given to us is limited to how God wants us to use it.

Meaning there are no short cuts for you. you will have to put in the time and effort, for if God just magiced you into belief then you would take all that you current believe about God with you, Rather than learning to seek who God really is through what the bible says. Take your view on Hell and how It can not be considered a void. or How God must be fair to those who hate Him and his followers. Or that God must always provide the easiest path for you to follow, Or the fact that you are here to trade good deeds and morality for granted wishes... I mean to ask why would you seek the actual God of the bible, if in your current understanding of God says He is to magic you into belief? If He does that, then where does He draw the line on what you believe verses how He actually is? Does it not make more sense to make you see Him on His terms from the beginning?

part 1