Evolution Trumps Creationism

[Beta Ray Bill]

Just incase you missed it the first time or maybe just incase you are praying that I do not understand the defination I posted here it is again:

In science and philosophy, ad hoc means the addition of extraneous hypotheses to a theory to save it from being falsified.

So now show me what I 'added' to make my work an 'ad hoc' theory.[/u]

Dude, I already posted the definition in my second post. Why do you think I need to be taught what it means?

Let's break it down:
ad hoc: the addition of extraneous hypotheses to a theory to save it from being falsified.

extraneous: irrelevant or unrelated to the subject being dealt with.
hypotheses: a supposition or proposed explanation made on the basis of limited evidence as a starting point for further investigation
theory: a supposition or a system of ideas intended to explain something, esp. one based on general principles independent of the thing to be explained
falsified: proven (a statement or theory) to be false

Are we clear on those definitions? Let's test them against your post:

Evolved man or "monkey man" is man without a soul,

Where is your proof of this? Where in the Bible does the term "monkey" ever come up? That sounds like a hypothesis to me. There is no Biblical foundation. If I am wrong, quote me the scripture that talks about "monkey man."

and In the Garden Man created in the image of God, would be man with a soul. That would leave room for whole complete fossil record that could not biblically be reconciled. It also explains the city Cain moved to and the wives and husbands the children of Adam and Eve took for themselves. (They intermingled with monkey man/woman and pass their gift onto their children.)

Again, how can you verify this? So homo habilis man had no soul? Where does the Bible, the Torah or the Koran even mention "monkeys without a soul?" So something that "could not be biblically reconciled" is the word of God? You're saying that man evolved for millions of years, then God just decided to stop at homo sapiens, because they looked like Him? If what you say is true, that was EVOLUTION, not CREATION. Your idea is just a HYPOTHESIS (see definition above) being used to link evolution to the Bible, and that, my friend, is ad hoc. It is a hypothesis trying to keep the Bible from being falsified. There is NO religious backing to your claims.

Now I know the goto verse to disprove this is in Genesis 5:4 After he begot Seth, the days of Adam were eight hundred years; and he had sons and daughters. 5 So all the days that Adam lived were nine hundred and thirty years; and he died.

In the English it seems that Adam's total existence was 930 years. But when we look at the Hebrew the word that is translated "lived" is:Chaya it means:1) to live, have life, remain alive, sustain life etc... (In short Mortal life)

Huh? So Adam "had life, remained alive, sustained life" for 930 years? Sounds about the same to me as "lived." How many people in Genesis lived hundreds of years? Most of them. There is no scientific backing to that. Science shows that primitive man lived about 30 years. Look it up. It's far more believable than the estimates in Genesis are.

At the fall Adam's eternal existence with God died as promised in Gen 2:16 And the Lord God commanded the man, saying, “Of every tree of the garden you may freely eat; 17 but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die.”

I know how you'll defend this. You'll say "it means that he will now be mortal and subject to death." Nope. That's not what it means. It means that if he eats the fruit, he dies. It says "For in the day..." not "in 930 years (or days)."

When they were exiled they were given "Chay" which means a Mortal life, of plants, of animals, dependent on water.
Genesis 3:
17 Then to Adam He said, “Because you have heeded the voice of your wife, and have eaten from the tree of which I commanded you, saying, ‘You shall not eat of it’:
“Cursed is the ground for your sake;
In toil you shall eat of it
All the days of your life.

At this point Adam's immortality ended and his clock started on his 930 years. These were all of the days He spent on THIS Earth. (not the Garden/Presents of God/Heaven)


How do we know they were immortal in the Garden with God? because of Genesis 2:16And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, "Of every tree of the garden you may freely eat;

Amongest those trees was the tree of life. What did the tree of life do?

Genesis 3:22Then the LORD God said, "Behold, the man has become like one of Us, to know good and evil. And now, lest he put out his hand and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever"--

All Biblical speculation. Not ad hoc, but totally un-provable. What about every other religion on the Earth? Are two-thirds of the Earth a bunch of fucking idiots? Of course not. And neither are Christians. But no one can claim their faith is any more "true" than anyone else's. Religion cannot be proven. Not all of Science can, either, but a lot of it can be, whereas none of any religion can be.

So to recap:
God created Man and woman and placed them in the garden. They could have been there a day before eating the forbidden fruit or they could have been there the 900 million bazillion years the scientist believe it took to evolve. Why? because there is no recorded time time between: "In the beginning" and the fall of man. Only speculation because we can count the generations back 6000 or so years.

Did you know the Jews were never in Egypt? There is absolutely no record anywhere on this Earth - except the errancy-filled Bible - that the Jews were ever there. How does that affect your counting of generations?

When in fact all we can really say is that man has been out of the Garden 6000 or so years. We know the Garden was a sanctuary, and that God kept Man created in His image there for an undisclosed amount of time. This does not means the rest of the world did not have to evolve as the undeniable fossil record proves.

So you admit fossil records are undeniable? Good job! But you're saying they are obviously implied in the Bible? Fail! ad hoc!

Why is it important to distance this theory from Gap creation theory?? Because it combines the unmolested Genesis account AS RECORDED IN THE BIBLE, with the evolutionary data we have discovered and can not other wise reconcile. Without Adding anything to scripture or taking anything away. This also explains several other creation "paradoxes" that atheist tend to use to disprove the genesis account.

Again, find me the word "monkey-man" in the Bible. Find me the word "evolution." Can't do it? Then maybe this theory of yours has no Biblical merit. Maybe it is changing what the Bible originally meant because, to use your phrase, the undeniable fossil record shows that how man understood the Bible for 4000 years doesn't work. The facts prove it. Your ideas are extraneous (irrelevant or unrelated to the subject being dealt with). Evolution is totally unrelated to creationism, unless changes are made to the idea of creation.

I have only taken the face value account of Genesis and lined the holes up with the holes in the evolutionary account of origins and they fit together perfectly.

Not in the least. They are extraneous hypotheses that attempt to keep the Bible from sounding simple-minded and irrefutably incorrect. You're making stuff up to fill in these "holes" in the account just so they'll work with Creationism. Very creative. But there is NO WAY you can ever prove them, because they are all SPECULATION. Don't think I can prove Evolution? Go back to school. Just go to a museum. Clear as day.

Because there is literally nothing the atheist can say or do to disprove anything.

That is your opinion. I think I did a pretty good job. If I had a doctorate in human history, I'd really kick your butt. Alas, I am just a pretty damn smart atheist.

...many who originally greeted me with harsh words and complete disrespect started to ask legitimate questions.

I have been stern, but I have never used harsh words on you, or disrespected you (okay, maybe the Pictionary joke was a little strong). I ask nothing of you. Truth be told, your theories have only strengthened my belief in Evolution. You showed me how far-fetched the human imagination can be, and I thank you for that.