(October 9, 2013 at 12:44 pm)Sword of Christ Wrote:(October 9, 2013 at 12:31 pm)Chas Wrote: You haven't refuted atheism; you can't refute a non-belief except by proving your claim.
You're not claiming that God didn't create the universe then? If you genuinely don't know and have no bias you can't be refuted only schooled in the ways of God, and then you'll come to a life changing understanding. Unless you resist but you can only do this by making the counter claim which is what you're really up to. You put up all these smoke screens and play around with words.
We don't make such a claim. We're saying we don't know how the universe started. Conversely, how do you rationalize that the Universe was actually "created". Think first before you answer; we don't want an answer that presupposes god or you'll never properly come to a sound conclusion on this. Again; how do you know the universe is a product of creation?