themonkeyman Wrote:
Here is one for the Religious Fanatics Here on this Forum.
1) You say that God exists. Can I ask then why there has been not a single Prophesy / Miracle or major enlightenment of people by this said God since he stopped writing documents and texts 2000 years ago.
There have been, they have been dismissed. I've personally brought several to this forum, and despite the truth of the situation I've been labled a liar and the works of god were over looked for known explainations.
My Reply: So you are saying that the Dead Sea has been parted more recently. Are you saying that thousands of people have risen from the dead. Are you saying that Goliath is wandering the earth. Are you saying that the Tower of Babel really existed. If you say miracles have occured then prove them and not just a miracle that could bexplained with a little reason and logic. A Miracle which leaves me wondering - What the fuck. Like a Stick turning into a snake is a kinda big deal for me. As is turning the Dead Sea red!
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2) Can I ask why you are basing your faith on a document that was written by people who had a very limited Grasp of Knowledge. Think a toddler trying to explain the Bible.
Because Christ Himself said that we must willing to become like Children in order to approach God. It is with these simplistic concepts that undeniable truth is found.
If you are faithful to the simple god will flood you with the complex. (and the ablity to comperhend and explain it simply enough to those who are in the process of seeking.)
My Reply: So what Jesus essentially said is to believe in him we must be ignorant of everything else we know to be true and believe in Blind faith. Because being like a toddler means to come with no understanding not simple truths. The earth rotates around the sun - Is that a simple truth as it cannot be directly proven? To be as children is a way for him to keep 'His' flock of people from actually waking up and smelling the coffee.
You yourself are quite knowledged in the Bible and Scripture so you also negate yourself as you also use vast amounts of scriptural refrences to back up a point when infact you should take it as Is. Like this. The Unforgivable Sin is talking evil against the Holy Spirit. But you yourself are bending that!
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3) You say that all non-Christians goto hell. If does this not indicate a failure in Gods 'All Saving' grace in that God still could not save people who did not believe in him
"All saving Grace" as you are attempting to use the term is not a biblically supported doctrine.
My Reply: So what was the point in Jesus comming to earth if God ultimately wants us saved. It seamed that there is still more people going to hell than heaven so it looked like him loosing his 'Second' son resulted in very little positive change. Or was this because God is an evil tyrant that he wants to send us to hell so he sent his son so he had an excuse to torture those who didnt believe?!
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3a) based on the above question can we sufficiently say that God would rather people Burn for Eternity just because they asked for evidence to believe in him.
God provides 'proof' for all of those who Ask, Seek, Knock.
My Reply: I asked God the other day to heal all those with Cancer / Feed the Hungry I told him its my last straw for believing in him and what happened - Nothing. So was I not in the right place with my heart because I am sure among the millions of other people praying for the same people would have resulted in some movement!
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Also if Jesus had to take our sins upon him why was it conditional on belief. Why could he not have accepted all sins.
Jesus did take all sins upon Him, but not all of us wanted our sins to be taken. Above all else God is righteous. A Righteous God will not force someone into an eternity of service if that person does not want to serve.
My Reply: Yes but that same person does not want to serve knowing that the same God would send their own loved ones to Hell! Are you North Korean or something - According to your logic if I dont want to follow God's army I perish! Why can I not just cease to exist or better yet just go to a limbo.
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3b) Jesus mentioned a Sin that he cannot forgive - This again proves that Jesus cannot forgive anything and it also causes a paradox in that Jesus who said that whoever believes in him will goto heaven.
Only if you insist that blaspheme of the Holy Spirit is taking the phrase 'Holy Spirit' and pairing it with a 'bad word.' However the paradox is resolved if one see the blaspheme as it is demonstrated in the two passages this story is found.
My Reply: But again this proves that Jesus cannot forgive everything and thus his death is insufficient for sins!
Quote:
According to this same person if you commit this sin - despite believing in him you wont goto heaven so Jesus was a Liar!.
One can not believe in Christ and deny the Holy Spirit. The holy Spirit was the power given to Christ.
My Reply: Is it not possible that the Holy Spirit (Spirit of God) was not given to jesus what so-ever. Look at it this way - I always had a problem believing Jesus was God even when I was a Christian, Could it not be said that my Holy Spirit guarded me against false teachings. As a Christian I always believed God Almighty is the only God!.
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4) With regards to the Fundie Christians Here, Do you really think your ignorant attitude will make me want to love your God when I know that most Christians are like you.
No. Nothing we can say or do will Make you do anything. The purpose of me being here is to answer questions so you can make an informed desision as to where you want to spend eternity. I do not care what you choose for yourself, so long as you make a choice knowing full well the decision that you have made. That said it is my hope to see a few of you on the otherside.\
My Reply: But you are basing it upon your Religion being correct. Lets just say that we have Abrahamic Religons e.g. the ones that believe in the Same Ultimate God. Well 2/3 say that worshiping Jesus is wrong! So the likelyness of Christianity being right against the backdrop of Abrhamic Religions is unlikely. Heck there is a reason why the Jews didnt believe in Jesus.
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I am sorry but your nature shows you dont want to save anyone, It appears more like you want to hurt people.
If one's eye cause him to sin pluck it out or if one's hand causes him to sin cut it off. "The pain" I am calling attention to is point out a great need to reconsile, whatever it is I see that is keeping you from a relationship with God.
My Reply: I had prayed to God like all other Ex-Christians we seeked God. Please do not think Drich that I just decided not to believe, It was a gradual process with no answers. I hear Christians say God will never Give us more than we can handle. So please explain why I fell away when he gave me more than I could handle. I worried about that Sin named above so much so I lost sleep / felt hopeless / sad and to be honest I stayed that way for 8 months of this year every day. I then told God one last time - I need a Miracle otherwise we are finished and he never gave the miracle. As far as I am concerned I gave God one last chance - Just so I knew the pain I was feeling was worth it and I got no response. So either God left me or God Ignored me either way both responses have turned me against him.!
Quote:
5) WHY DID GOD CREATE EVIL?
God allows evil as it is the 'proof' of the independance we have from God's expressed will.
My Reply: God allows evil - So God wants us humans to fall from grace on purpose?
Quote:
5a) WHY DID GOD CREATE HUMANS THAT ARE NATURALLY ATTRACTED TO EVIL?
Not all are, but we are all slaves to sin. God did not create man with a predisposition for sin. Man choose to sin, and then reproduced replicating being predisposed to sin.
My Reply: All have sinned and fall short of the Glory of God. Remember that verse - God did create man to sin otherwise Adam and Eve would not have ate the tree. Adam and Eve did not choose to sin! - If they did know nothing of Good and Evil how can said people sin!
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5b) WHY DID GOD CONDEMN HUMANS FOR THEIR OWN DESIGNED NATURE?
For the same reason HE provided us a way to atone for our sins.
My Reply: He did not provide a way - You said that Miracles Exist / Well surely God would know what it would take Miracle wise to convert every unbeliever on this planet so why does he not give everyone a personal custom revelation then let us reject it. I am not talking about ooh hey look I got a quarter from a friend today Im talking about 'Hey look I'm living in a Mansion'
Whats your come back.
Here is one for the Religious Fanatics Here on this Forum.
1) You say that God exists. Can I ask then why there has been not a single Prophesy / Miracle or major enlightenment of people by this said God since he stopped writing documents and texts 2000 years ago.
There have been, they have been dismissed. I've personally brought several to this forum, and despite the truth of the situation I've been labled a liar and the works of god were over looked for known explainations.
My Reply: So you are saying that the Dead Sea has been parted more recently. Are you saying that thousands of people have risen from the dead. Are you saying that Goliath is wandering the earth. Are you saying that the Tower of Babel really existed. If you say miracles have occured then prove them and not just a miracle that could bexplained with a little reason and logic. A Miracle which leaves me wondering - What the fuck. Like a Stick turning into a snake is a kinda big deal for me. As is turning the Dead Sea red!
Quote:
2) Can I ask why you are basing your faith on a document that was written by people who had a very limited Grasp of Knowledge. Think a toddler trying to explain the Bible.
Because Christ Himself said that we must willing to become like Children in order to approach God. It is with these simplistic concepts that undeniable truth is found.
If you are faithful to the simple god will flood you with the complex. (and the ablity to comperhend and explain it simply enough to those who are in the process of seeking.)
My Reply: So what Jesus essentially said is to believe in him we must be ignorant of everything else we know to be true and believe in Blind faith. Because being like a toddler means to come with no understanding not simple truths. The earth rotates around the sun - Is that a simple truth as it cannot be directly proven? To be as children is a way for him to keep 'His' flock of people from actually waking up and smelling the coffee.
You yourself are quite knowledged in the Bible and Scripture so you also negate yourself as you also use vast amounts of scriptural refrences to back up a point when infact you should take it as Is. Like this. The Unforgivable Sin is talking evil against the Holy Spirit. But you yourself are bending that!
Quote:
3) You say that all non-Christians goto hell. If does this not indicate a failure in Gods 'All Saving' grace in that God still could not save people who did not believe in him
"All saving Grace" as you are attempting to use the term is not a biblically supported doctrine.
My Reply: So what was the point in Jesus comming to earth if God ultimately wants us saved. It seamed that there is still more people going to hell than heaven so it looked like him loosing his 'Second' son resulted in very little positive change. Or was this because God is an evil tyrant that he wants to send us to hell so he sent his son so he had an excuse to torture those who didnt believe?!
Quote:
3a) based on the above question can we sufficiently say that God would rather people Burn for Eternity just because they asked for evidence to believe in him.
God provides 'proof' for all of those who Ask, Seek, Knock.
My Reply: I asked God the other day to heal all those with Cancer / Feed the Hungry I told him its my last straw for believing in him and what happened - Nothing. So was I not in the right place with my heart because I am sure among the millions of other people praying for the same people would have resulted in some movement!
Quote:
Also if Jesus had to take our sins upon him why was it conditional on belief. Why could he not have accepted all sins.
Jesus did take all sins upon Him, but not all of us wanted our sins to be taken. Above all else God is righteous. A Righteous God will not force someone into an eternity of service if that person does not want to serve.
My Reply: Yes but that same person does not want to serve knowing that the same God would send their own loved ones to Hell! Are you North Korean or something - According to your logic if I dont want to follow God's army I perish! Why can I not just cease to exist or better yet just go to a limbo.
Quote:
3b) Jesus mentioned a Sin that he cannot forgive - This again proves that Jesus cannot forgive anything and it also causes a paradox in that Jesus who said that whoever believes in him will goto heaven.
Only if you insist that blaspheme of the Holy Spirit is taking the phrase 'Holy Spirit' and pairing it with a 'bad word.' However the paradox is resolved if one see the blaspheme as it is demonstrated in the two passages this story is found.
My Reply: But again this proves that Jesus cannot forgive everything and thus his death is insufficient for sins!
Quote:
According to this same person if you commit this sin - despite believing in him you wont goto heaven so Jesus was a Liar!.
One can not believe in Christ and deny the Holy Spirit. The holy Spirit was the power given to Christ.
My Reply: Is it not possible that the Holy Spirit (Spirit of God) was not given to jesus what so-ever. Look at it this way - I always had a problem believing Jesus was God even when I was a Christian, Could it not be said that my Holy Spirit guarded me against false teachings. As a Christian I always believed God Almighty is the only God!.
Quote:
4) With regards to the Fundie Christians Here, Do you really think your ignorant attitude will make me want to love your God when I know that most Christians are like you.
No. Nothing we can say or do will Make you do anything. The purpose of me being here is to answer questions so you can make an informed desision as to where you want to spend eternity. I do not care what you choose for yourself, so long as you make a choice knowing full well the decision that you have made. That said it is my hope to see a few of you on the otherside.\
My Reply: But you are basing it upon your Religion being correct. Lets just say that we have Abrahamic Religons e.g. the ones that believe in the Same Ultimate God. Well 2/3 say that worshiping Jesus is wrong! So the likelyness of Christianity being right against the backdrop of Abrhamic Religions is unlikely. Heck there is a reason why the Jews didnt believe in Jesus.
Quote:
I am sorry but your nature shows you dont want to save anyone, It appears more like you want to hurt people.
If one's eye cause him to sin pluck it out or if one's hand causes him to sin cut it off. "The pain" I am calling attention to is point out a great need to reconsile, whatever it is I see that is keeping you from a relationship with God.
My Reply: I had prayed to God like all other Ex-Christians we seeked God. Please do not think Drich that I just decided not to believe, It was a gradual process with no answers. I hear Christians say God will never Give us more than we can handle. So please explain why I fell away when he gave me more than I could handle. I worried about that Sin named above so much so I lost sleep / felt hopeless / sad and to be honest I stayed that way for 8 months of this year every day. I then told God one last time - I need a Miracle otherwise we are finished and he never gave the miracle. As far as I am concerned I gave God one last chance - Just so I knew the pain I was feeling was worth it and I got no response. So either God left me or God Ignored me either way both responses have turned me against him.!
Quote:
5) WHY DID GOD CREATE EVIL?
God allows evil as it is the 'proof' of the independance we have from God's expressed will.
My Reply: God allows evil - So God wants us humans to fall from grace on purpose?
Quote:
5a) WHY DID GOD CREATE HUMANS THAT ARE NATURALLY ATTRACTED TO EVIL?
Not all are, but we are all slaves to sin. God did not create man with a predisposition for sin. Man choose to sin, and then reproduced replicating being predisposed to sin.
My Reply: All have sinned and fall short of the Glory of God. Remember that verse - God did create man to sin otherwise Adam and Eve would not have ate the tree. Adam and Eve did not choose to sin! - If they did know nothing of Good and Evil how can said people sin!
Quote:
5b) WHY DID GOD CONDEMN HUMANS FOR THEIR OWN DESIGNED NATURE?
For the same reason HE provided us a way to atone for our sins.
My Reply: He did not provide a way - You said that Miracles Exist / Well surely God would know what it would take Miracle wise to convert every unbeliever on this planet so why does he not give everyone a personal custom revelation then let us reject it. I am not talking about ooh hey look I got a quarter from a friend today Im talking about 'Hey look I'm living in a Mansion'
Whats your come back.
Rants and Raves from an Ex-Christian http://walkofthemonkeyman.blogspot.co.uk/
