Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: August 2, 2025, 8:50 am

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
The cosmological argument really needs to die already.
#7
RE: The cosmological argument really needs to die already.
The modus ponens form of this argument is invalid.

The argument, in any version, is guilty of the fallacy of equivocation, among others.

In premise 1. the phrase 'begins to exist' is referring to creation ex materia. In other words, the rearrangement of already existing matter and energy.

Then, in premise 2, 'began to exist' is referring to creation ex nihilo.

Same phrase, 2 meanings = Fallacy.

If you rephrase the argument using the 2 meanings, you get -

1. Everything that is a rearrangement of existing matter/energy has a cause.
2. The universe is a rearrangement of existing matter/energy.
3. Therefore the universe has a cause.

As you can see, premise 2 in this argument does not say what theists want it to say.

If we use the other meaning -

1. Everything that is created out of nothing has a cause.
2. The universe was created out of nothing.
3. The universe has a cause.

Now we see that premise 1 is suspect because we have no examples of things that were created out of nothing to examine.

There is also the fallacy of composition. Just because something is true of a part of the whole, does not mean it is true of the whole.

It is a very weak argument that seems to be convincing to theists.

EDIT: I found another rephrasing of the argument that also shows the equivocation fallacy, on Ironchariots.com -

1. Every rearrangement of pre-existing matter has a cause. (supported by every observation, ever.)

2. The universe began to exist from absolute nonexistence, NOT from a rearrangement of pre-existing matter.

3. Therefore the universe has a cause.

In other words:

1. Every X has a cause.

2. The universe Y.

3. Therefore the universe has a cause.

You'd believe if you just opened your heart" is a terrible argument for religion. It's basically saying, "If you bias yourself enough, you can convince yourself that this is true." If religion were true, people wouldn't need faith to believe it -- it would be supported by good evidence.
Reply



Messages In This Thread
RE: The cosmological argument really needs to die already. - by Simon Moon - December 12, 2013 at 4:03 pm

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  The Kalam Cosmological Argument Disagreeable 123 13226 December 15, 2024 at 6:11 pm
Last Post: BrianSoddingBoru4
  The Cosmological Proof LinuxGal 53 8150 September 24, 2023 at 12:24 pm
Last Post: LinuxGal
  Proving What We Already "Know" bennyboy 171 28040 July 30, 2022 at 1:40 am
Last Post: bennyboy
  Shouldn't the right to die be a human right? ErGingerbreadMandude 174 28946 February 4, 2017 at 7:52 pm
Last Post: vorlon13
  How do you punish people that want to die? ReptilianPeon 16 5030 July 5, 2015 at 3:17 pm
Last Post: Whateverist
  Leibnizian Cosmological Argument MindForgedManacle 7 3138 September 18, 2013 at 11:47 pm
Last Post: MindForgedManacle
  Questions on the Kalam Cosmological argument MindForgedManacle 10 3517 July 26, 2013 at 9:37 am
Last Post: little_monkey
  Something that can strengthen the cosmological argument? Mystic 1 1785 April 8, 2013 at 6:23 am
Last Post: A_Nony_Mouse
  Right to die Welsh cake 49 20211 July 26, 2012 at 7:22 pm
Last Post: Reforged
  Simple existence - Cosmological argument leading to God Mystic 5 4227 June 14, 2012 at 4:26 am
Last Post: genkaus



Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)