RE: Does it make sense to speak of "Universal Consciousness" or "Univer...
May 14, 2014 at 7:34 pm
(This post was last modified: May 14, 2014 at 7:55 pm by Mudhammam.)
(May 12, 2014 at 10:44 pm)bennyboy Wrote: Let me take this further-- as devil's advocate only.
We know mind exists, because here we are. Whether we believe in substance dualism or not, it's clear that the minds we have are somehow related the brain, specifically the flow of information among the cells of the brain. Well, we have a complex flow of information among people, especially on the internet. It's possible to think of humanity now as a unified entity in some degree, as we are (almost) all interfaced through the internet-- our ideas, preferences, changing beliefs, etc. are represented in that context. Somehow, the Internet has an identity of its own that transcends our own reality.
So is the Internet a living thing? Does it have its own awareness, somehow greater than the sum of the individual human minds which contribute to it? I think somehow you could say it does. While some individuals contribute greatly to certain causes, there's a kind of cloud processing there which produces actual results that nobody could predict. In that sense, we are tools of the Internet rather than vice versa.
The invention of the internet is not very far off from Pierre's Tielhard de Chardin's writings from the 1930s in which he put forth the notion of the "Noosphere," a "sphere of human thought" that "emerges through and is constituted by the interaction of human minds. The noosphere has grown in step with the organization of the human mass in relation to itself as it populates the Earth. As mankind organizes itself in more complex social networks, the higher the noosphere will grow in awareness. This concept extends Teilhard's Law of Complexity/Consciousness, the law describing the nature of evolution in the universe. Teilhard argued the noosphere is growing towards an even greater integration and unification, culminating in the Omega Point - an apex of thought/consciousness - which he saw as the goal of history."
Noosphere
(May 13, 2014 at 9:52 am)whateverist Wrote: Do you have in mind some sort of centralized mega-entity comprising us all? If so, do you think that it has intentions and volition? I don't personally believe so in either case.
IMO there may be a universal substrate to each individual's consciousness. But it would be universal in a topological/thematic sense, not in a linked/collaborative way.
No, I don't think so. I agree with whoever said consciousness is localized in individual brains...it's interesting to ponder that we essentially all originate from the same quantum event, so in some sense it seems like we're all One...also in the sense that all electrons are identical. But I don't really take it past the initial thought, too much philosophical speculation. I suppose some physicists with Eastern leanings find it appealing and argue that physics supports something like that. But in terms of evidence, the only thing that seems to support that view is telepathy. I'm not willing to rule it out yet because it does seem like a lot of humans claim to have telepathic experiences in terms of strong intuitions, but eh. It's something I have to look deeper into.
(May 14, 2014 at 7:21 pm)bennyboy Wrote: It's a neat idea, but with one problem: modern physics is at least as woo as the science it's supposed to be replacing.
Whose definition of woo though? I wouldn't call the spooky nature and behavior of fundamental particles or the origins of matter "wooy" even if they do sound totally absurd, as long as they're supported by concrete evidence. To paraphrase Nietzsche, one must see reason in reality, not in more reason.
