RE: A reason to believe?
April 30, 2010 at 1:07 pm
(This post was last modified: April 30, 2010 at 1:14 pm by Atheist_named_Christian.)
(April 30, 2010 at 11:43 am)fr0d0 Wrote:No, it is not (yes it is that simple). Religion is exactly about NOT questioning the values of your respective church. Christian authorities are giving ABSLOUTE ethical values which are not to be questioned. As soon as you start thinking about any kind of religion it will turn out to be either illogical or completely pointless.(April 30, 2010 at 5:57 am)Atheist_named_Christian Wrote: There are several problems:In essence Christianity is about questioning your values unselfishly. Again, you're talking perversion by people.
1. There is no "right" or "wrong" - moral absolutism is one of the worst things about christianity (and most other religions, too). It leads to intolerance and arrogance based on values one is not allowed to even think about. It is not a given that your or my set of ethical values is the best (whatever that should mean) - it is important to question these values.
(April 30, 2010 at 11:43 am)fr0d0 Wrote:First of all: Society is not at all secular - at least in most states. Maybe in Scandinavia and France. Elsewhere: NO.(April 30, 2010 at 5:57 am)Atheist_named_Christian Wrote: 2. Realism is not involved at all. If this was the case, religion wouldn't need a divine being that punishes those who disobey.I don't see how this is relevant. In our secular society there's punishment for wrongdoing. None of us are free from it. People thrive knowing their boundaries. It would be incorrect to conclude that Christianity was about fear. That would be to miss the point.
And actually, I think Christianity is almost exclusively about exploiting peoples fears - mostly their primal fear: What happens, when I die - and it gives them a completely stupid answer. But people are so desperate in this matter, that they accept ANY positive answer. But it is bullshit - no one knows what "happens" to you after death and the most likely answer is simply NOTHING. But that is hard to accept.
(April 30, 2010 at 11:43 am)fr0d0 Wrote:I fully agree here, but I also do not see how any theologist would come to a conclusion other than: There is no god. There is for sure no rational argument for the existence of god and the historical evidence for jesus is highly questionable (and if he existed he is for sure not god's son).(April 30, 2010 at 5:57 am)Atheist_named_Christian Wrote: 3. Logic and religion are completely incommensurate, as religion builds on faith that is founded purely irrationally.Whilst faith has to be irrational, the consideration of theology is entirely rational and logically coherent internally.
I came to the conclusion, that the more intelligent theologists surely know that religion is bullshit; but they just keep it up in order not to be rendered completely useless. It is almost certain that most high authorities of religious institutions do themselves not believe what they actually tell.
THE POPE DOES NOT BELIEVE IN GOD!
(April 30, 2010 at 12:33 pm)EvidenceVsFaith Wrote: Why not? How about the following. Because: out of every single one of the reasons you so confidently gave above not one of them was evidence whatsoever that belief in God is actually true.
Completely true! But it happens quite often, that believers defend their ideas just by rendering them "useful". I think that this directly shows, that these people are not able to think logically as soon as matters get slightly more complicated.
And even these arguments can be easily proven wrong - religion is not at all useful to humanity. It's very much the opposite.