RE: An unorthodox belief in God.
June 6, 2014 at 11:02 am
(This post was last modified: June 6, 2014 at 11:06 am by Fidel_Castronaut.)
(June 6, 2014 at 10:54 am)mickiel Wrote:(June 6, 2014 at 10:38 am)Fidel_Castronaut Wrote: But you then need to clearly define both where we, as a homonid species, began 'thinking' and subsequently where that 'thinking' culminated in the formation of civilisation.
You also need to define what you mean by 'civilisation'. Do you mean social, cohesive groups? Do you mean buildings? Do you mean cities?
The issue you have is that we have large reams of evidence to suggest that homo sapiens were not unique both in their ability to 'think' or their ability to form cohesive societal groups. Indeed, we don't even have to look into antiquity to garner evidence of this. Great apes today reveal to us their capability to 'think'; to assess an obstacle in front of them and reassess their behaviour and their actions to overcome or adapt.
And I think a further elucidation of 'consciousness' would be helpful here because, as above, if it is not defined coherently it's liable to fall apart at the slightest rebuttal.
I think reference to the ice age equating to the 'obvious turning point' may be a non sequitur. I can see evidence of adaption to a new environment, but I can't see evidence of it being a proverbial 'light bulb' moment where homo sapiens went from mindless, drooling savages (arguable on this point even but you get my point) to scholars, builders and artists.
I appreciate you're simply bounding your thoughts of us. However, if we are to have a debate on origin, saying 'I think' sort of debilitates your thesis if you then proceed to say 'This definitely happened'.
Alright then, no more saying " I think", no more using Caps, if anyone else has things they want me to do and stop doing, just let me know. This definitely happened; these are historical events that happened to prove consciousness led to civilization;
transportation
education
science
religion
language
math
astrology
agriculture
war
archaeology
All this and more are signs of a definite curve in now conscious man, that primordial did not have in our capacity.
Why? Again points to a god.
Again, you're not citing an actual origin here.
learning to make a rudimentary axe is conducive to eventually formulating a strategy of war.
Learning to sit in a cave in larger groups is conducive to the knowledge of safer in numbers.
Learning to place foliage over your ditch to protect you from the elements is conducive to building a sky scraper to house thousands of people.
Primordial 'man' (what do you mean by 'man' by the way?) had many skills of survival and adaption that were precursors to the society we live in today, but it appears you've discounted them?
You've started looking at this 'curve' when it was half way up.
None of this points to a god. It points to an argument from ignorance and an argument from personal incredulity ("there's no way this could mean anything other than x").
I'd also appreciate some elucidations on my previous points.
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