(June 8, 2014 at 1:26 am)Freedom of thought Wrote: What if I were to assert that the universe existed in this timeless state you're talking about?
You certainly could assert that. Given that the universe now exists in a state of time, how did time come into existence?
(June 8, 2014 at 1:26 am)Freedom of thought Wrote: And isn't god omnipotent, and omniscient? Which means he has INFINITE power and INFINITE knowledge.
I'm not sure I fully understand what you mean by "Infinite." To say that God can do anything we can imagine is not Biblically supported. The Bible states He cannot lie, and He cannot deny Himself. I would also say that He couldn't cause Himself to not exist nor create a rock too heavy for himself to lift.
(June 8, 2014 at 1:26 am)Freedom of thought Wrote: Infinities are impossible right?What do you mean?
(June 8, 2014 at 1:26 am)Freedom of thought Wrote: Religious logic: "The universe existing without a cause is absurd, and infinities can't exist, so I'll propose a being which exists without a cause to cause the universe, since the universe can't exist without a cause, and this cause has infinite in knowledge and power, even though I claim infinities can't exist and those traits don't follow from my argument..."To address the infinities can't exist assertion: Who has made this claim? Please explain how infinities can't exist.
To address the 'universe existing without a cause' line of reasoning: you're not understanding the argument. Go back and read post #18.
(June 8, 2014 at 7:46 am)Tonus Wrote: How does he transcend time?Another good question that is probably better left to people far smarter than myself. I will offer the best analogy I have according to the knowledge I have.
God created time and yet he transcends it (He is not held subject to it's properties) If I were to create a dinner plate I would transcend that dinner plate. Certainly the plate is not alive, yet I am. The plate cannot move yet I am able to. The plate cannot think nor reason yet I am able to do both. So just as I am able to transcend something I have created, so to God is able to transcend His.
(June 8, 2014 at 7:46 am)Tonus Wrote: Then we're back to my original quip-- he literally waited forever to begin creating.Forever is a measure of time. Can someone wait an amount of time in a state of timelessness? This seems nonsensical.
(June 8, 2014 at 4:22 pm)Ryantology (╯°◊°)╯︵ ══╬ Wrote:(June 7, 2014 at 11:03 pm)orangebox21 Wrote:
The statement 'If God is timeless (then) He can't be old' is what is known as a hypothetical syllogism. It is a hypothetical statement assumed for the sake of determining what conclusions can be logically inferred if the statement is true.
Secondly in asking for scientific evidence to prove God you make a categorical mistake. Science is the study of the material world. God is spirit. How can the study of the material world explain a non-material entity? This would be like me asking you to prove that ultraviolet light exists by using only your eyes. Or, answer 2+2=? using colors. Not all light is detectable from the human eye, numbers are used to answer math questions and colors are used to answer the visible light spectrum questions.
If it could be proven beyond doubt that God exists...
and that He is the one spoken of in the Bible...
would you repent of your sins and place your faith in Jesus Christ?
