Understanding atoms.

[CoxRox]

The forces that control atoms are the strong and weak nuclear force and of course electro magnetism. If these forces were any stronger or weaker then atoms would become unstable and would not exist as we know them. Hence the Universe would be a very different place.

I think what you are driving at is that there 'has' to be a reason why they are the way they are and that it all seems so 'fine tuned' that it isn't unreasonable to presume some sort of divine tuner.

Yes and not just that but how is the fine tuning kept finely tuned? Let's suppose 'chance' gives rise to just the right conditions for the subatomic particles to form. How are the conditions maintained to give rise to all these chances?

The problem with that is that this divine tuner has to be at least as complex as the system that he has set up and so that doesn't really answer anything.

Maybe it's not complex the way we imagine it must be.

To answer the question, Why is there this order? The answer must be simply because there is. It must exist for us to be able to pose the question in the first place. We obviously live in a Universe that is capable of supporting life because we are here.

Again, and I know I keep banging on about this, the Universe is the way it is because it is the one that we live in. It can be no other way as we would not be here to ask these questions.

I have no problem with this. I'm asking 'why' and 'how'. How is this universe 'held together' or rather how are the laws that hold together the universe etc, held together?

You use the phrase "Just in the right measure". Right for who? For the atoms to form This suggests that there was a purpose for the Universe but, the Universe had no plans for its future. It simply is the way it is because that's the way it is. This is also true for many other Universes that are no doubt very different with various tuning to the 20 or so constants that ours have.
When you look at your new born baby, do you really believe that it's just chance that such 'miracles' exist? The complexity that has evolved, and that seems steered, can give rise to such a miracle? I can't view this as just 'chance'. It goes against my senses.

None of these that are unstable unlike ours will harbour life asking why their Universe is chaotic and random and incapable of supporting life. It's only those systems that 'work' where the conditions for such a question can arise in the first place.

And if another order maintains this order then what maintains the first order, and so on. The trouble is that we are only aware of one Universe with one set of laws. If we could 'see' all the others then we would no doubt understand that it is all just luck and the only reason things are the way they are is because we were lucky enough to have been born in a Universe that allowed such things.

What I'm really talking about is the rather misunderstood anthropic principle.