RE: If Only The Romans
December 29, 2014 at 6:11 pm
(This post was last modified: December 29, 2014 at 6:43 pm by Lek.)
(December 29, 2014 at 4:49 pm)Pickup_shonuff Wrote: Obviously you're not grasping the point: unreasonable dogmas often succeed to the detriment of scientific principles and sound moral philosophy, and this is sometimes reflected in the worship of state leaders believed to be endowed with otherworldly powers or an individual's personal deity. The advantage of atheist tyrants is that their ideas tend to subsequently die when the madman does, an outcome much more difficult to achieve when a religious tradition with thousands of years of ingrained superstition is involved.
Kark Marx's anti-religious stance has led to more murders and persecution through communist governments than I care to count and still goes on to this day.
(December 29, 2014 at 5:52 pm)abaris Wrote:(December 29, 2014 at 5:50 pm)Lek Wrote: It's not so much about God being pissed , but that the price for sin has now been paid.
I'm afraid to even ask, but you mean the god sacrificing himself to god part again?
Yes.
(December 29, 2014 at 6:02 pm)abaris Wrote:(December 29, 2014 at 5:55 pm)Lek Wrote: Were the Amalekites better off dying quickly by the sword or dying in the way most people do?
What's that even supposed to mean?
A natural death is certainly preferable than being slaughtered to the last child by a raving band of goat fucking savages.
I don't agree with you. I'd rather die that way than from a long painful illness. What I'm trying to say is that we all have received the death sentence from God, not just the Amalekites. The new testament God allows us to die in worse ways that the Amalekites or those who drowned in the great flood. Did those who died in the typhoon that hit the Philippines die in a worse way? What I'm saying is that God has control over life and death. Although you don't believe in God, you believe that the christian God is a monster. Christians believe that our suffering is because of our sin and that because Jesus paid the price for our sins, we will receive eternal life of happiness. That's what the bible teaches about God. You have your opinion about God, but it's not what the bible teaches.
(December 29, 2014 at 5:25 pm)Esquilax Wrote: Have you taken a look at modern atheist leaders, rather than just the few that happen to agree with the position you've already accepted? Australia had an atheist leader for a while: no murders. Or, hell, you can actually, like, look back into the past and see plenty of leaders who weren't the three you theists always seem to pick: Here's a list. It took me five minutes to find. So how dare you pretend that those three examples- none of whom committed their atrocities in the name of atheism- are perfectly representative? Doesn't that seem a little.... dishonest, to you?
But because I'm not one to be dishonest in service to my ideological presuppositions, let me take a minute to help you out using the research you evidently didn't want to do yourself. If you wanted to find an atheist who actually was a poor leader in service to atheism (it's a debatable point, but possibly the strongest example in your favor I've come across) here's Enver Hoxha of Albania, who turned his country into an atheist state and arrested priests and religious practitioners for show trials. This is as close as you will come, in my experience, to an atheist leader whose human rights violations can be directly tied to his atheism. I give you this so that maybe you and your fellow presuppositional knuckleheads (don't think I haven't noticed that you've also defined "true christianity" by only positive attributes. That's some prime fiat dishonesty there) can at least be historically accurate when you try to misrepresent the history of atheism in politics. It's on me.
I also saw a list of some modern day atheist leaders and I granted that atheists can be good leaders of nations. I also said the same thing about christian leaders. "True" christianity does only have positive attributes, but that's not true for christains. Some act better than others. I'm not going to bother giving you a list of good christian leaders of nations.
(December 29, 2014 at 6:08 pm)abaris Wrote:(December 29, 2014 at 6:06 pm)Lek Wrote: Give me a break! Are you telling me that Franco killed 250,000 people in Spain because he was a catholic? The same with Pavelic and Pinochet.
Not because but in spite. And there goes your argument of no christian killing, since the love thy neighbour bullshit exists.
And I guess, now Josef Stalin and Pol Pot didn't kill people because they were atheists, or is there suddenly a double standard?
I retract my general statement about atheist leaders. Some do and some don't. I'll even say that a true christian can murder, but he is acting against the teachings of christianity. In the same way as an atheist can espouse good morality and murder someone, therefore acting against what he accepts as right.
(December 29, 2014 at 3:56 pm)Tonus Wrote: So... we shouldn't use god, or the heroes of the old testament, as role models? I guess it's a step in the right direction. Not as good as them never having been mass killers in the first place, but... baby steps.
Most of the old testament heros had huge moral flaws, so I wouldn't want to emulate all of their behavior. I can't use God as a role model in all ways because he is a different being than I am. I do use God in the person of Jesus as a role model for humanity.
Whew! I'm tired.
