(September 9, 2010 at 8:19 pm)ThinkingMan Wrote: I'm absolutely baffled as to how atheists do not accept the existence of a creator and can only imagine there views are based on stupidity, illogical and incorrect application of science rather then intellect, logic, science etc.That's fine. I'm absolutely baffled how otherwise rational people can accept that a person you cannot ever see touch smell or feel created the universe despite no supporting evidence whatsoever.
Aren't we all amazed here?
(September 9, 2010 at 8:19 pm)ThinkingMan Wrote: Science rocks however it deals only with tangible phenomenon. Since God is something of the unseen we cannot apply science to God. Therefore in this respect trying to 'prove' God with science is complete stupidity. Of course when we apply science to tangible phenomenon sicence can prove/disprove a lot of things. Moreover when people like apparent scientific agnostics say we are waiting for a god to be proven, the stupidity of their statement is completely ignorant of science itself considering God is not tangible to us.God is just as unprovable by science as any other product of my or human imagination, but why is god given special treatment over things like spiderman, unicorns, and godzilla?
(September 9, 2010 at 8:19 pm)ThinkingMan Wrote: Nothing in existence creates itself or exists by its own accord. The very nature of anything in the known universe is that every thing is limited and dependent on something esle to maintain its existence. The question arises so where did everything come from. The only logical answer is that there must have been an initator/creator that started everything. The properties of this initiator/creator is that it is not limited or dependent on anything else to exist. Therefore God created everything and God has nothing before him.No one in science who understands the field has ever postulated that the universe arose from nothing. Were this the case, it would violate anyway some important fundemental principles in physics (like the first law of thermodynamics.) That's something that people like you who want to interject a creator into the mix despite the fact that there are many truely unknown variables in terms of how life and the universe began.
The fact that you and other theists want there to be a god there doesn't excuse the fact that there is no real reason, at this time, for a god to be necessary for anything.
(September 9, 2010 at 8:19 pm)ThinkingMan Wrote: It really is so simple. If I say x+3=5. You will say x MUST be 2 otherwise the rest of the equation cannot hold true. The proof that x is 2 is the rest of the equation. Likewise the proof that God exist is us, we are the proof. If he didnt exist theres no way that we would exist. The unlimited undependant creator is the neccessity for our universe to exist.Things are never that simple. The oversimplification such as what you postulated above is necessary for theists such as yourself to cover for the lack of understanding of the scientific principles and decades of hard labor and scientific discovery. There are no easy answers, but some people attempt to make things up to have them anyway, but the imaginings of primative men could never really bring humanity any closer to the actual underlying truths of the universe. We'd only be deluding ourselves.
(September 9, 2010 at 8:19 pm)ThinkingMan Wrote: It really is not complicated, hidden or strange at all. You merely need to think sensibly and everything becomes clear. If you want to dispute anything in this article please address the specific points I have made with science, logic and reasoning. If you cannot, then that clearly shows your views on life are devoid of any intellect, logic etcAnd you're already attempting to limit the arguement so you can restrict the answers given to you to be only the ones you want to hear. Theists present arguements like this because they are not interested in truth or honesty, but only in the specific answers the theist debater wants to hear.
If today you can take a thing like evolution and make it a crime to teach in the public schools, tomorrow you can make it a crime to teach it in the private schools and next year you can make it a crime to teach it to the hustings or in the church. At the next session you may ban books and the newspapers...
Ignorance and fanaticism are ever busy and need feeding. Always feeding and gloating for more. Today it is the public school teachers; tomorrow the private. The next day the preachers and the lecturers, the magazines, the books, the newspapers. After a while, Your Honor, it is the setting of man against man and creed against creed until with flying banners and beating drums we are marching backward to the glorious ages of the sixteenth centry when bigots lighted fagots to burn the men who dared to bring any intelligence and enlightenment and culture to the human mind. ~Clarence Darrow, at the Scopes Monkey Trial, 1925
Politics is supposed to be the second-oldest profession. I have come to realize that it bears a very close resemblance to the first. ~Ronald Reagan
Ignorance and fanaticism are ever busy and need feeding. Always feeding and gloating for more. Today it is the public school teachers; tomorrow the private. The next day the preachers and the lecturers, the magazines, the books, the newspapers. After a while, Your Honor, it is the setting of man against man and creed against creed until with flying banners and beating drums we are marching backward to the glorious ages of the sixteenth centry when bigots lighted fagots to burn the men who dared to bring any intelligence and enlightenment and culture to the human mind. ~Clarence Darrow, at the Scopes Monkey Trial, 1925
Politics is supposed to be the second-oldest profession. I have come to realize that it bears a very close resemblance to the first. ~Ronald Reagan